Where is MAURA MURRAY

I know Firecat somewhere said that her leaving Amhurst as early as 2:30 has debunked - and I agree.

Now - depending upon cell phone findings (where was she or could have been at various times along I-93, plus considering realistic mph for the car and its condition - and comparing that to the arrival time at the site - we could know how much "extra" time remains. We can also do that in the points between Amhurst and where we know she was when the call did not go through.(Obviously we have to consider margins of error.)

Any of you folks that work at a college have friends that are math or physics professors?

Two questions:

1. The above calculations to place Maura

2. Tell us what would happen to a solid rectangular plane - in the shape of a car hood - if it was hit by a force from its southwest corner. The rectangular plane has marginal leeway below it. It is a metal substance that is struck by something significantly solid.

Earlier in my "paper experient" I asked "what do you see?"

Now I'll tell you what I saw - the paper shape almost mirrored the appearance of Maura's hood.

http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n10/Murray...

But I want a second opinion from someone in the field.

I hadn't put a lot of thought into the fact that no blood was found in the car by police. The less time available for a crime the less time for a murder / cleanup (which I think would be nearly impossible anyway - if Maura wasn't killed in Amhurst.)

So - if she got in the car and then a crime happened - it couldn't be murder, but instead kidnapping. But I explain why it would take at least 2 people to kidnapp her her a few pages ago.

Of course no blood does not eliminate the possibility of her fleeing the accident of which her starting a new life (alone or with new boyfriend or other unknown)- or - up the road abduction.

Hello Benjamin Franklyne,

However much I sincerely appreciate your good thinking, I have to disagree when you confidently state that the I-93 is out of the question.

Since there is considerable uncertainty as for when Maura presumably commenced her journey north, time time factor remains a big question mark, in my opinion.

Maura could in fact have joined MA State Route 2 a short drive north of Amherst,MA, and from there continued eastwards on MA 2 via Leominster to Littleton, MA.
From there she could have entered the north-bound I-495, joining the north-bound I-93 at Lawrence,MA, and passing very close to, incidentally, Londonderry,NH, on the way north.

Alternatively, she could have followed MA 2 as far as Lowell, MA, where the US 3 route goes north via Nashua,NH, joining the I-93 at Manchester, NH. The US 3 also passes very close to Londonderry, NH.

Please, check out the Google Maps or MapQuest, if this doesn´t make any sense...

Sadly, no. I'm fairly segregated to my own little corner of dorkdom. No math or physics profs EVER come down my hallway.

As for there being no blood in the car....I wonder, rather suddenly, if the spilled red liquid that is presumed to be wine IS wine, but was used as a handy liquid to splash onto the car to remove any trace blood. Undoubtedly wouldn't be of any use on a cellular/DNA test level (or probably even luminol) but I don't know if any of those tests were done. Just a random thought before it "flew out my other ear" (I love that, whiston). It's certainly not the best way to clean up after a murder, but if it's the only liquid you have available and you're trying to stage an accident and confuse LE anyway, who knows?

But the original thought I wanted to post was that it does not take blood evidence to murder someone. There's asphyxia, there's poison (too slow) there's even blunt force trauma that causes internal hemorrhaging but no external blood loss. Or there's murder that happens elsewhere....no blood in the car.(I guess that's abduction and subsequent murder)

Does anyone watch Trutv? Haunting Evidence?

One show after another today. One paranormal investigator, one medium and one psychic profiler work together at cold case scenes giving impressions of what happened, who did it, etc. Earlier today the show was about Molly Bish; Thom Shamshank was in that episode.

I wonder what they would come up with if they visited the 112 site (that is if they haven't already).

Eurobserver wrote:

Hello Benjamin Franklyne,
However much I sincerely appreciate your good thinking, I have to disagree when you confidently state that the I-93 is out of the question.
Since there is considerable uncertainty as for when Maura presumably commenced her journey north, time time factor remains a big question mark, in my opinion.
Maura could in fact have joined MA State Route 2 a short drive north of Amherst,MA, and from there continued eastwards on MA 2 via Leominster to Littleton, MA.
From there she could have entered the north-bound I-495, joining the north-bound I-93 at Lawrence,MA, and passing very close to, incidentally, Londonderry,NH, on the way north.
Alternatively, she could have followed MA 2 as far as Lowell, MA, where the US 3 route goes north via Nashua,NH, joining the I-93 at Manchester, NH. The US 3 also passes very close to Londonderry, NH.
Please, check out the Google Maps or MapQuest, if this doesn´t make any sense...

Well this brought up a whole other idea.

Hmmmm. going 60 MPH on side roads would certainly be a reason for the car to have prior damage - plus be away to avoid authorities.

I almost finished my post below and realized this.

On the Cell phone - I've posted here already - don't want to post a third time how they work. Sigh. I got the information from an independent source. Also, the evidence in White Wash's post describing the call says the call was TO Maura. The Caller was near Littleton. Maura could have been anywhere.

Whiston told us she was at the bank at 3:27 PM.

Lets play out a scenario in which I 93 is the route she took.

I'll start at Amhurst - with her going 60 miles an hour on business and residential roads that are going most likely - 35 miles an hour and have traffic and stop signs. But I've given her the luck of never hitting a stop sign.

From Amhurst to Turners Falls 17.3 miles, 17 minutes. Now its 3:44.

Lets go from Turners Falls to Littleton. Lets just call this a freeway with no traffic.

62.8 mi, I'll give you 75 miles an hour - 10 miles an hour over the speed limit at least. 50.24 minutes.

Its now 4:34. She's in Metro Boston on 495 during rush hour.

19.5 miles to Andover. Average speeds at rush hour are say 40 if lucky - but I'll give you 75 miles an hour. 15.6 minutes, its now 4:50.

She still has 167 miles to go to Woodville. I'll give you 75 miles an hour. 2 hours 13 minutes going at 75 miles an hour. She'd get to Woodsville at 7:03 PM if she was in the car from the ATM immediately and went 75 miles an hour the whole way. She would have to run every stop sign, never stop, drive in the emergency lane at rush hour on the 495, and go 75 miles an hour on the two lane 112, but she'd make it with 20 minutes to spare. That is if her Saturn were a Porsche and no police officer stopped her for reckless drivinng. Out of the question.

Now - as far as roads between I-93 and I-91 I haven't looked yet.

But if we ignored the impossibility of it - I93 would put Maura in the car talking to Atwood. No time for kidnapping.

Not all roads provide the driver with perfect conditions for driving to allow 60 MPH or higher speeds. The effect can be that the shortest route is not the fastest - it depends on the standard of road by which you are traveling on. Interstate roads live up to a standard to allow high speeds which are necessary for the distance taken on the route.

A good example of this is the shortest route between San Jose CA and Los Angeles CA involves taking California 49 south from U.S. 101 and cutting over to Interestate 5 by way of CA 189 if my memory serves me on 189. Could be 192. Its the road that goes to Coalinga form Hollister. I drove 49 and 189 and they are virtually traffic free. It is at least 50 miles shorter of a drive that way.

However - it took an hour longer - because if I had gone the same speeds as I could have on the Interstate - I would have crashed my car very early on.

Eurobserver wrote:

Hello Benjamin Franklyne,
However much I sincerely appreciate your good thinking, I have to disagree when you confidently state that the I-93 is out of the question.
Since there is considerable uncertainty as for when Maura presumably commenced her journey north, time time factor remains a big question mark, in my opinion.
Maura could in fact have joined MA State Route 2 a short drive north of Amherst,MA, and from there continued eastwards on MA 2 via Leominster to Littleton, MA.
From there she could have entered the north-bound I-495, joining the north-bound I-93 at Lawrence,MA, and passing very close to, incidentally, Londonderry,NH, on the way north.
Alternatively, she could have followed MA 2 as far as Lowell, MA, where the US 3 route goes north via Nashua,NH, joining the I-93 at Manchester, NH. The US 3 also passes very close to Londonderry, NH.
Please, check out the Google Maps or MapQuest, if this doesn´t make any sense...

Well this brought up a whole other idea.

Hmmmm. going 60 MPH on side roads would certainly be a reason for the car to have prior damage - plus be away to avoid authorities.

I almost finished my post below and realized this.

On the Cell phone - I've posted here already - don't want to post a third time how they work. Sigh. I got the information from an independent source. Also, the evidence in White Wash's post describing the call says the call was TO Maura. The Caller was near Littleton. Maura could have been anywhere

Watching it right now in fact + looking to see if there's a website to submit things on.

Firecat - I see your point - but - most people try to fight off a strangler.

Kidnapping then murder I agree with.

Whiston told us she was at the bank at 3:27 PM.

Lets play out a scenario in which I 93 is the route she took.

I'll start at Amhurst - with her going 60 miles an hour on business and residential roads that are going most likely - 35 miles an hour and have traffic and stop signs. But I've given her the luck of never hitting a stop sign.

From Amhurst to Turners Falls 17.3 miles, 17 minutes. Now its 3:44.

Lets go from Turners Falls to Littleton. Lets just call this a freeway with no traffic.

62.8 mi, I'll give you 75 miles an hour - 10 miles an hour over the speed limit at least. 50.24 minutes.

Its now 4:34. She's in Metro Boston on 495 during rush hour.

19.5 miles to Andover. Average speeds at rush hour are say 40 if lucky - but I'll give you 75 miles an hour. 15.6 minutes, its now 4:50.

She still has 167 miles to go to Woodville. I'll give you 75 miles an hour. 2 hours 13 minutes going at 75 miles an hour. She'd get to Woodsville at 7:03 PM if she was in the car from the ATM immediately and went 75 miles an hour the whole way. She would have to run every stop sign, never stop, drive in the emergency lane at rush hour on the 495, and go 75 miles an hour on the two lane 112, but she'd make it with 20 minutes to spare. That is if her Saturn were a Porsche and no police officer stopped her for reckless drivinng. Out of the question.

Now - as far as roads between I-93 and I-91 I haven't looked yet.

But if we ignored the impossibility of it - I93 would put Maura in the car talking to Atwood. No time for kidnapping.

Not all roads provide the driver with perfect conditions for driving to allow 60 MPH or higher speeds. The effect can be that the shortest route is not the fastest - it depends on the standard of road by which you are traveling on. Interstate roads live up to a standard to allow high speeds which are necessary for the distance taken on the route.

A good example of this is the shortest route between San Jose CA and Los Angeles CA involves taking California 49 south from U.S. 101 and cutting over to Interestate 5 by way of CA 189 if my memory serves me on 189. Could be 192. Its the road that goes to Coalinga form Hollister. I drove 49 and 189 and they are virtually traffic free. It is at least 50 miles shorter of a drive that way.

However - it took an hour longer - because if I had gone the same speeds as I could have on the Interstate - I would have crashed my car very early on.

Benjamin Franklyne wrote:

<quoted text>
Well this brought up a whole other idea.
Hmmmm. going 60 MPH on side roads would certainly be a reason for the car to have prior damage - plus be away to avoid authorities.
I almost finished my post below and realized this.
On the Cell phone - I've posted here already - don't want to post a third time how they work. Sigh. I got the information from an independent source. Also, the evidence in White Wash's post describing the call says the call was TO Maura. The Caller was near Littleton. Maura could have been anywhere

I believe White Wash said Londenderry N H and not Littleton. In the late afternoon hours of Feb.9th 2004 an outgoing call was made to Maura from the Londonderry tower. This call had to have been made from with in a 22 mile radious of the tower.

Hello all,

I just checked out MapQuest and found this:

Amherst,MA - Swiftwater, NH via I-93 (Lincoln,NH):
196 miles = 3 hrs 55 minutes

Amherst,MA - Swiftwater, NH via I-91 (Woodsville,NH):
151 miles = 2 hrs 47 minutes

Benjamin Franklyne wrote:

Firecat - I see your point - but - most people try to fight off a strangler.
Kidnapping then murder I agree with.

Of course she would have tried to fight off a strangler, providing she hadn't been subdued first. Or strapped into her seatbelt and unable to fight effectively, or tangled in an airbag. Or stunned, or shaken from an accident, or.....or or or. So many variables. one of them simply being if she had enough time to assess the situation and react--something I hope West Point would have helped with if this is the case.

FireCat wrote:

<quoted text>
Of course she would have tried to fight off a strangler, providing she hadn't been subdued first. Or strapped into her seatbelt and unable to fight effectively, or tangled in an airbag. Or stunned, or shaken from an accident, or.....or or or. So many variables. one of them simply being if she had enough time to assess the situation and react--something I hope West Point would have helped with if this is the case.

Hello FireCat & all,
Yes, I agree that we often tend to forget that Maura, after all, is a highly trained West Point cadet, most likely very well versed in all sorts of self-defence techniques quite apart from being an extremely fit athlete and runner.
She may be a stunning beauty, but she is definitely not a kind of "Barbie doll" girl who doesn´t know how to defend herself.

Another thing:
On the web site "Rachel´s Message Board" I found a message, dated 21st January 2008, from a guy calling himself "Ben" who purports to have seen Maura in Mexico. Seriously or not is hard to say, as there is no further information.

There's a guy who owns a red Ford pu always got firewood in it who worked next door to an Amherst art gallery who is acquainted if not friends with someone near where the car was found and who lived in a spot Verizon didn't reach too well.

Or there's a biz with access to her medical records and which also owned both the school bus and ambulance located a 60 second walk from sw and could have seen her walk past every day.

Or there's a storage guy whose friend can jam cell phones and is buddies with a guy who lived in Jackson nh and who also spent lots of time in woods near where a palmer area teen was found.

Or there's a mystery someone - not mv owner - stood to lose everything if the car that hit Vasi wasn't smashed up or destroyed pdq. Which car hit Vasi?

Or if there is in fact a restriction on incoming calls on the line the disturbing call came in on, well that narrows it down a lot further than most might think.

how far's an ICC bar off the ground?

Sybil wrote:

There's a guy who owns a red Ford pu always got firewood in it who worked next door to an Amherst art gallery who is acquainted if not friends with someone near where the car was found and who lived in a spot Verizon didn't reach too well.

Is this fact or supposition?

Sybil is not getting out of the house much.

Mcsmom, did the info re: the Lexus help you at all? There is a vehicle near me with NH tags that says MCSMOM !