Where is MAURA MURRAY

elsewherebriefly wrote:

<quoted text>
I've had several years to read up on the facts and statements made by Maura's family members and loved ones. Your 'reasonable conclusion' is unfounded.
Mr. Murray is directly quoted as saying that the accident Maura had with the Corolla was not a big deal.

He certainly said that. Do I believe him? Absolutely not. Why? Because I can't imagine any father not thinking it was a big deal when his son or daughter wrecked his new car causing 8 to 10 grand in damage and was 100% at fault. If he had said, "Yes, I was very upset and I told her so," I would have believed him. Instead, I now question anything he says always wondering what he's concealing and why.

I am amazed by the extent to which some people are willing to suspend their common sense because they feel sorry for him.

Mason wrote:

<quoted text>
He certainly said that. Do I believe him? Absolutely not. Why? Because I can't imagine any father not thinking it was a big deal when his son or daughter wrecked his new car causing 8 to 10 grand in damage and was 100% at fault. If he had said, "Yes, I was very upset and I told her so," I would have believed him. Instead, I now question anything he says always wondering what he's concealing and why.
I am amazed by the extent to which some people are willing to suspend their common sense because they feel sorry for him.

There is absolutely NO GOOD REASON to say this about Maura Murray's father.

Mason wrote:

<quoted text>
He certainly said that. Do I believe him? Absolutely not. Why? Because I can't imagine any father not thinking it was a big deal when his son or daughter wrecked his new car causing 8 to 10 grand in damage and was 100% at fault. If he had said, "Yes, I was very upset and I told her so," I would have believed him. Instead, I now question anything he says always wondering what he's concealing and why.
I am amazed by the extent to which some people are willing to suspend their common sense because they feel sorry for him.

Do you have any kids?

Or, conversely, are you someone's youngest daughter?

My take on why Fred was genuinely not upset at Maura about the car and said the accident was "no big deal" :

Hi, daddy? It's me, Maura.

Honey, you seem upset, what's wrong? You're shaking.

Daddy, I just slid your car into a ditch.

Oh my God. Are you ok???

No, I'm fine. But I really smashed up your car.

ARE YOU HURT?

No, daddy, I promise I'm fine. Not even a scratch. But your car.....

*******

Let me tell you, I have had this conversation. Granted, it wasn't a ditch. I got rear-ended and shoe-horned into the person in front of me. Believe me when I tell you this. After they hear "I promise you I'm completely unhurt" they stop listening. When you try to tell them their car is wrapped around a Jeep Grand Cherokee, THEY DON'T CARE. All that matters to them is that their daughter is not the one needing $10,000 worth of repair.

FireCat wrote:

<quoted text>
Do you have any kids?
Or, conversely, are you someone's youngest daughter?
My take on why Fred was genuinely not upset at Maura about the car and said the accident was "no big deal" :
Hi, daddy? It's me, Maura.
Honey, you seem upset, what's wrong? You're shaking.
Daddy, I just slid your car into a ditch.
Oh my God. Are you ok???
No, I'm fine. But I really smashed up your car.
ARE YOU HURT?
No, daddy, I promise I'm fine. Not even a scratch. But your car.....
*******
Let me tell you, I have had this conversation. Granted, it wasn't a ditch. I got rear-ended and shoe-horned into the person in front of me. Believe me when I tell you this. After they hear "I promise you I'm completely unhurt" they stop listening. When you try to tell them their car is wrapped around a Jeep Grand Cherokee, THEY DON'T CARE. All that matters to them is that their daughter is not the one needing $10,000 worth of repair.

That's exactly right. Well said! Thank you!

Mason wrote:

<quoted text>
Peri,
I recall reading that Billy Rausch did not find a note. He only found a stack of letters he wrote to Maura. An old note or letter to him would have been an unlikely discovery since she would have mailed it to him or tossed it. If he found a note to him, I suspect it would have been a recent note that she had not mailed to him, or a note she specifically left for him on top of her stuff.
I also recall reading that the campus police said she left him a note. They entered her room first and I suspect they found a sealed envelope on top of her stuff with his name on it. I doubt they opened it. Instead they told him about it and he would have broken the seal and read the note or letter when they admitted him to the room. Yet, he supposedly said she didn't leave a note.
I find his statement difficult to believe, unless it was a suicide note and he didn't want to say that in public. This might explain why, within a few days of her disappearance, he said he thought she was dead. At least, I recall reading that he did, although my memory is not firm on that point. Maybe someone else recalls.
M

Billy like everyone who was close to Maura was afraid something terrible had happened to her because it was very out of character for her not to contact him on Monday night, as well she did not contact Fred.
I did not say Billy found the note, he examined the note and stated it was from sometime previous, and was in no way a good bye note. This is one of the misrepresentation by law enforcement, like their statement that Maura likely came to the white mountains to commit suicide. Just plan cruel and deceptive and not the truth.

FireCat wrote:

<quoted text>
Do you have any kids?
Or, conversely, are you someone's youngest daughter?
My take on why Fred was genuinely not upset at Maura about the car and said the accident was "no big deal" :
Hi, daddy? It's me, Maura.
Honey, you seem upset, what's wrong? You're shaking.
Daddy, I just slid your car into a ditch.
Oh my God. Are you ok???
No, I'm fine. But I really smashed up your car.
ARE YOU HURT?
No, daddy, I promise I'm fine. Not even a scratch. But your car.....
*******
Let me tell you, I have had this conversation. Granted, it wasn't a ditch. I got rear-ended and shoe-horned into the person in front of me. Believe me when I tell you this. After they hear "I promise you I'm completely unhurt" they stop listening. When you try to tell them their car is wrapped around a Jeep Grand Cherokee, THEY DON'T CARE. All that matters to them is that their daughter is not the one needing $10,000 worth of repair.

I don't agree. I have a daughter I love dearly and I would not allow her to manipulate me like that. Your example sounds like a cliche ridden father in a Hollywood script.

Mason wrote:

<quoted text>
Peri,
Since you admit that MAJOR STUFF drove Maura to leave Amherst, whether it happened in Amherst or someone else, don't you agree that whatever it was it's relevant to deciding if she left Amherst with the intent of killing herself or starting a new life?
The people who live in the community where the Saturn crashed and Maura disappeared have good reason to resent the focused and unrelenting suspicion that someone in their community abducted and killed Maura. I would feel that way if I lived there. In fact, I would feel like I had a duty to defend my community and the police because the suspicion is so unfair and one-sided.
I would be furious to be told that any question about Maura's intent and state of mind when she left Amherst is "not important" because some dirt bag in my community obviously killed her. To also be accused of blaming the victim and exhibiting some sick form of pleasure from tarnishing her image as the All American Girl would just about drive me stark raving mad.
Why do so many people seem so unable to grasp the fundamental unfairness of this situation?

It is not a matter of fairness or equity, there are things to be investigated in Amherst, surely, however, this occured to many from the get go and it has been investigated. It is important when the witness saw Maura with the hockey bag, it is important to know if this is the witness that reported seeing her on Monday at 3:30-4:00, it is important for law enforcement to know these things, and I want to question this person throughly, and too the phone call is troubling at 0040 Thursday yes police need to investigate this, that being said, there are two witnesses in Haverhill who have told falsehoods, and Sgt. Smith told a falsehood, all these falsehoods are serious. Why a person is not forthcoming is compelling and as stated before it might be looking for 15 minutes of fame and it maybe to conceal evidence.

When witnesses are not forthcoming their are the authors of their own misfortune, we sow what we weep.

As some will argue, the Amherst aspect has been checked out, and the obviously there is reasons why the Dectective have not moved far from the accident sight. We do not know all the details, and are not privy to this information. Also, the police are holding things tight to their breast.

No stone should be left unturned, and I don't feel a tad sorry for anyone who lies in such a situation, they have the oportunity to come forward and say why they were not forthcoming.

Incidentially, the police have not concentrated their investigation on Amherst, that is likely for a VERY profound reason.

Again, suicide victims do not bury their own bodies, and if law enforcement stated they are likely to bring criminal charges in this case, it is unlikely she is living with the draft doggers in the hills of Nova Scotia or Newfoundland or somewhere in the states equally obsure. Police would have stopped searching long ago in the area if they do not believe something happened to Maura there, or if those involved did not live close by. This much we know, the investigation has not left Haverhill, it had widened and then narrowed. Remember also the FBI did most of the investigation in Amherst, as well as the PI's.

Yes by all means the police need to check these things out, and verify the validity and veracity of these sitings in Amherst.

White Wash wrote:

So if she had retreive her phone and
shower and dress prior to 2!
So 12ish back on campus if not earlier when did
Maura sleep?
I can't image that Fred wouldn't bring her
back so she could get some rest after being up all night!<quoted text>

White Wash
Exhaustion is the likely the reason she needed a rest. Fred bringing Maura back for a rest, for all we know she rested at the Motel and pretty difficult to tell your children what to do when they are adults. I have gone days and days without sleep, especially after a shock or being over tired, my guess is that Maura hatched the plan to leave on Sunday and likely had not much rest that night either.
She was burning the candles at both ends...and so it seems so unlikely to be drinking an driving, especially Vodka in a diet coke bottle, the effects would have been rather immediate, and too we do not know if she ate on Monday.

Mason wrote:

<quoted text>
I don't agree. I have a daughter I love dearly and I would not allow her to manipulate me like that. Your example sounds like a cliche ridden father in a Hollywood script.

Mason:
How do you see this as manipulate, it was an accident, some people place little value on monetary things, and only the well being of their loved one is what counts. Why would he be upset other than she should never have come at the hour, it was a mistake but once things are done they are done, can't cry over spilt milk, and Maura was profoundly upset, and likely very remorseful.

I smashed into an illegally parked car while turning a corner, I was looking in the window of radio shack of a Christmas tree on Rememberance Day and was busy staring at it an blowed into the car. It was new and not mine, my friends were away down south, and when they came back I told the truth, they were not upset in the least, nor would they take the $250.00 deductable from me, it was never mentioned again. I was profoundly upset but they were not. Real life. It was an accident on my part. I did not report this to the police, the other person's car was not damaged. Their car was damaged. What they told the insurance company is anyone's guess, they never mentioned, and I help find them a cheap place to have the car repaired and offered monies, which as stated they refused.

White Wash wrote:

I have heard this from reliable sources as well.
My question is this why would she leave West Point and go to UMASS and continue with Engineering? Why not stay at West Point is was
madding in love with Billy!
This just makes no sense.
<quoted text>

White Wash:

Everyone in my family is in the military and for 5 generations, I considered an ROTP programme where my University could be paid, however, I would never have survived however I was so poor I was dearly tempted,and struggled to get a college education and worked four jobs to do so...

Some people do no realize that the military is not for them...not for a second is this hard for me to invision, one changes their minds, or worse you hate something and cannot bring yourself to quit and someone decides for you.. Some people it takes a while to realize they have made a big boo boo or believe if they try harder they can do this and they can't it is insurmountable. Besides Billy was on his way out,almost finished, he was in class with Julie Maura's sister, so he would not be there after that year.

Dawn wrote:

the sexual assaults came out in April 04- a couple of months after she left WP..........

Dawn: Rumsfeld made an announcement of an equiry into these sexual assaults on Thursday morning the day she was reduced to tears. Information can be found on net and on west point and have posted urls here somewhere.

Likely Maura knew all about this while it was happening which was over a period of time. I have speculated this might be the source of why she was upset. What she knew don't know? My guess her somber mood, silence and withdrawn and need to talk to Fred so late at night had something to do with this announcement but scepulating here.

Mason wrote:

QUESTIONS
Maura reacts hysterically to a phone call she receives early Friday morning. Did she sleep that night, or was she too upset?
Maura gets up early and attends a clinical program all day. She works at the art gallery that evening. How much sleep did she get?
She goes car shopping with her dad, but he doesn't buy her a car. He takes her to dinner at a brew pub and lets her borrow his new car. She goes to a party and wrecks his car at 3:30 am. She has it towed to the motel where he's staying and wakes him up with the news around 4 or 4:30 am on Sunday morning. How much sleep did she get Saturday night?
Her dad drops her off at the dorm and she works a shift at the art gallery. He calls her at 11:30 pm to discuss accident forms. How much sleep did she get Sunday night?
Does this situation look like a developing crisis due to anxiety, hysteria, fear, and sleep deprivation?
Was Maura even capable of rational thought when she left town Monday afternoon?

Joking here:

training for the life of hospital duty, sorry couldn't resist.

No it is serious, she must have been exhausted, and so difficult to understand drinking and driving, and we do not know what and when she ate, if anything after Sunday morning or at lunch
she was upset....and tired it is not rocket science that she was likely exhausted...literally

Mason wrote:

Eurobserver:
A thought regarding Maura lookalikes that have been "ruled out."
If Maura was taken in by a group of people with whom she may have shared her life story and desire to start a new life, isn't it possible that they may have responded to questions from investigators by saying that the Maura lookalike had been a member of their community for many years and therefore couldn't be Maura?

It has been ruled OUT!

Mason wrote:

Instead of going to Dunkin Donuts, someone might want to chance regularly attending a certain Assembly of God church in VT.
Read up on the Assembly of God first, however, because it ain't no mainstream church and one should be prepared to answer why one was "called" to attend.
I'd do it just for the halibut, but I live too far away.
M

Now that is a red herring and a waste of time, I'd go with Columbo and Weeper, get the farm the latter is a far wiser chice..

Quija wrote:

<quoted text>
This is the best guess I can think of. That would be a good way to protect a married man who was seeing her or who broke up with her that night.... To the other poster who asked, I believe it was from a CAMPUS PHONE, the kind where you don't need to dial 10 digital, like just an extension.

maybe someone informed her of the announcement of Rumsfeld, maybe someone involved in the mayhem of sexual assaults threatened her, or asked her to be a witness? Maybe Maura was afraid or had to weight her options, maybe Maura was assaulted, or knew someone who was assaulted? We do not know who phoned and are unlikely to find out, if law enforcement knows, it is evidentiary and secret.

Mason wrote:

EB,
BTW, I also said that Fred didn't hate Maura. I said his conduct showed that he was very angry at her.
I believe that is a reasonable conclusion to draw. Jeebus, I didn't even speculate about why he may have been angry. I don't know, so I didn't say anything.
You folks need to read before your nimble fingers start moving.

Mason please give Fred a rest, he said he was not angry!

Eurobserver wrote:

Hello all,
Since there was no "up-take" on my post # 12577, I take the liberty of re-iterating my question:
Regarding the disputed "Raykel" sighting in the Barton, VT, church:
I remember that somebody on this forum once mentioned having seen a girl looking very much like Maura on the website of some kind of religious community near Irasburg, VT, which is not far from Barton, VT.


Apparently the picture in question is no longer available on the relevant website, so there is no way of checking this out.
Anybody else remembers this discussion back in the summer (?) of 2008?

EO

There was a siting in a store, by Patrica who said the woman allegedly mouthed the words HELP!?
There was a siting in Vermount at a Disco, I though I saw someone look exactly like her in Habitant Nova Scotia at an American winery.

Weeper has stated these have all been researched, why can't you believe this! It is worned, tried, tested and all sightings including my own, are FALSE, that is to say those made thus far.

Weeper also has information to declare that this is a recovery operation at this point. Why do you not believe him, he has more information than we, and he would not say something so cruel if he was not able to substaniate his information, just because he doesn't place it here doesn't make it false.

gee left by myself again out of sync..internet on cable not functioning as frozen, likely broken wires

didn't mean to hog the board either, but no one seems to stay up late or get up early... sorry

thank you Anne for the information you have provided, this is VERY enlightening, Maura leaving in an unreliable vehicle, in haste, telling no one, now begins to make perfect sense.

Just needing to get away to think things over...
weigh out her options...

Is to scandalize be really a Crime? But to scandalize us with being guilty of Scandal, is in itself an egregious Absurdity, and can proceed from nothing but the most consummate Impudence in Conjunction with the most profound Stupidity!

This, supposing, as they do, that to scandalize is a Crime; which you have convinc’d all reasonable People, is an Opinion absolutely erroneous. Let us leave then these Ideot Mock-Moralists.

Yet, whatever Good I may do, I cannot pretend that I first entred into the Practice of this Virtue from a Principle of Publick Spirit.

For what great Difference can there be, between putting your self up, or putting your Neighbour down? Scandal, like other Virtues, is in part its own Reward, as it gives us the Satisfaction of making our selves appear better than others, or others no better than ourselves.

some argue that Scandal spoils all good Conversation, but I insist that without it there could be no such Thing.

By Industry and Application, I have made my self the Center of all the Scandal on this board, there is little stirring but I hear of it. I began the World with this Maxim, That no Trade can subsist without Returns; and accordingly, whenever I receiv’d a good story, I endeavour’d to give two or a better in the Room of it.

The Stock of Defamation thus naturally flowing in upon me, I practice an Art by which I can pump Scandal out of People that are the least enclin’d that way. Shall I discover a Secret? Yes; to let it die with me would be inhuman. If I have never heard Ill of some Person, I always impute it to defective Intelligence; for there are none without their Faults, no not one.

" FireCat wrote:
<quoted text>
Maura and Billy were planning a wedding for the fall of 2005. So, yes, in a matter of a few months (18 is, after all, only a few)"

When were they going to tell Fred? He seemed to be in the dark. Billy stated they were engaged to be engaged. What about the engagement part. Sharon never mentioned a fall wedding either.

18 is after all only a few? A few months? 18 is over a year and a half.???????

I will take your non-response as a confirmation that this is a bunch of B.S.

Thank you :)