Where is MAURA MURRAY

Beagle wrote:

<quoted text>
Law enforcement. The cops, feds, prosecutors.
Is it possible that...
if the Saturn hit Vasi while being driven by someone other than Maura (and Maura was not in the car at the time)...
Is it possible Maura feared that if she identified the Saturn's driver to police that the actual driver would then simply turn around and tell the police that it was Maura who was driving the Saturn when Vasi was hit?

Good thought

Dawn wrote:

John did you read it here on the site? And what it was in regards to? This all goes back to a phone call issue that I don't want to go over again. I am the aka phone expert - here. i work for the phone company and wireless prior for 18 years. I do not see how they could say a call was placed to her from the sprint londonderry site - we first need to know who called her - what carrier - subpeona that carrier - see where the hand off etc etc.. I have written alot on this topic.......One thing I do alot about.

I don't remember where I got this. Might have been Wikipedia. In any case, I don't have a reliable source. If your first hand knowledge rejects the 22 mile concept about the origination of the call, then I dismiss that from my docket of clues.

If Maura loaned the car to X and, after thinking it over, Maura decided to tell the police, truthfully enough, that X was driving the car when Vasi was hit and take a look at the fresh damage to the car, could X have turned right around and SUCCESSFULLY accused Maura of having driven car when Vasi was hit?

If the Saturn hit Vasi and if Maura was not the driver, was Maura TRAPPED by the actual driver's return accusation?

Did Maura have good reason to virtually know that the police would not believe her (Maura) when she told them that she (Maura) was not driving the Saturn?

John wrote:

<quoted text>
Good thought

Why?

OOps .. sorry I had to clarify..I'm actually pro choice.. sorry for the confusion.. something wasn't adding up.

The wikapedia site says - incoming call from londonderry site - we have to know WHO called her to know where that person was at....... and what carrier they used. Sprint is a tier 4 carrier - verizon,att,tmobile then sprint.. so.. the legal requirements to get this done - I do not think that happened. they would be interested in who was at londonderry - who was assigned that phone number etc.. i just don't see it. and this came from this affidavit/search warrant that just happened to be in the court house - for anyone to pick up a copy. legal dept at the phone co.. said NOPE.

Beagle wrote:

If Maura loaned the car to X and, after thinking it over, Maura decided to tell the police, truthfully enough, that X was driving the car when Vasi was hit and take a look at the fresh damage to the car, could X have turned right around and SUCCESSFULLY accused Maura of having driven car when Vasi was hit?
If the Saturn hit Vasi and if Maura was not the driver, was Maura TRAPPED by the actual driver's return accusation?
Did Maura have good reason to virtually know that the police would not believe her (Maura) when she told them that she (Maura) was not driving the Saturn?

Since Maura is known to have been working the security desk on that night, then she probably would have an airtight (or nearly so) alibi re personally being the driver of the car. We've been told in the past by her supervisor that aside from a short break -- during which Maura was in full view of a supervisor -- Maura had no other breaks and could not have been away from the security desk because a supervisor comes by to check the desks every 20 minutes.

It would seem to depend on how reliable the supervisor's words are. For example, "every 20 minutes" might be what is supposed to be done, but were the supervisors typically pretty lax about that? Maybe in reality they only checked the security desks once an hour. And a supervisor can't be expected to necessarily tell us that he/she "breached" the rules or knows another supervisor did on that night.

Beagle wrote:

<quoted text>Why?

Are you disputing yourself. I was just indicating that what you had said was well reasoned and worthy of consideration.

Dawn wrote:

The wikapedia site says - incoming call from londonderry site - we have to know WHO called her to know where that person was at....... and what carrier they used. Sprint is a tier 4 carrier - verizon,att,tmobile then sprint.. so.. the legal requirements to get this done - I do not think that happened. they would be interested in who was at londonderry - who was assigned that phone number etc.. i just don't see it. and this came from this affidavit/search warrant that just happened to be in the court house - for anyone to pick up a copy. legal dept at the phone co.. said NOPE.

I guess I don't remember where I got that 22 mile thing. But I follow you and trust your statement. But wouldn't the phone company happily cooperate with an investigation related to a high profile tragic story? So, if a detective called and said what can you tell us, wouldn't they be willing to divulge if they could conclude that the call originated from somewhere near that tower even if - without a warrant - they could not diverge the number? I don't know, just wanting to tap your expertise.

Beagle wrote:

If Maura loaned the car to X and, after thinking it over, Maura decided to tell the police, truthfully enough, that X was driving the car when Vasi was hit and take a look at the fresh damage to the car, could X have turned right around and SUCCESSFULLY accused Maura of having driven car when Vasi was hit?
If the Saturn hit Vasi and if Maura was not the driver, was Maura TRAPPED by the actual driver's return accusation?
Did Maura have good reason to virtually know that the police would not believe her (Maura) when she told them that she (Maura) was not driving the Saturn?

Maybe the driver was a friend and cop.

John
What kind of law do you practice? How did you find out about Maura Murray ? Curious. Would like to hear from a newbie.

Welcome

You might keep quiet about a hit and run if you loaned your car to a friend and she hit a pedestrian, left the scene, and maybe the pedestrian might not live.

And you might keep quiet if you loaned your car to a friend who was impaired and then she struck and maybe killed someone crossing the street.

But in neither case would you have a rock solid reason to fear being arrested by the police for having been the DRIVER of the car when it hit the pedestrian.

John wrote:

<quoted text>
Are you disputing yourself. I was just indicating that what you had said was well reasoned and worthy of consideration.

I would just like to know why you think it was well reasoned and worthy of consideration. Not being a wise guy or a vain wise guy, just interested in hearing your reasons, that's all. Thanks.

No you cant give that information due to priavacy laws. A subpeona would be required to Maura's phone company - they would identify the incoming caller - determine - landline/cell/payphone - then would need an additional subpeona to release that information - that person would be contacted as well. Makes no sense - and who cares that the londonderry tower carried the call - that does not mean they were close to it. they hand off from tower to tower - and it says its a sprint tower - so now the other caller had sprint to.. sounds good on paper but in reality it doesn't work that way. You can be more than 20 miles ( 22 is from wikapedia site) from a site to use that site. Here in Seattle you can pick up victoria bc on a clear day on the waterfront and that is 120 + maybe more miles away. wireless is line of sight so anything can happen... what does happen is all documented though.

Almost to the level of quotes such as I'm not a scientist not even a scientologist.. however that one is by far my favorite. Hard to beat that one. Knock your teeth out was pretty good too. It is like watching movie over and over just the charachters change

Dawn wrote:

John
What kind of law do you practice? How did you find out about Maura Murray ? Curious. Would like to hear from a newbie.
Welcome

Thanks Dawn. Appreciate the welcome. I no longer practice. I am a management consultant now. When I did practice I was involved in some corporate and some class action law. I don't remember when I first heard of her disappearance, but it was not long after Feb. 9 2004. It did not make much of an impression on me, as I - like most - screen out mass media promulgated tragedy. But a few months ago, I saw a story, started reading more, got interested. I think even aside from the disappearancre, which might be simply a wrong place, wrong time thing, the case is still interesting considering baffling little details (rag in tail pipe) and coincidences (Vasi) simply in terms of how she got to 112 and OPL. For whatever reason, the particular curiousness of this particular case fascinates me. Maybe because I went to college in Boston and hiked often in the white mountains. Maybe that makes it more personal for me.

Beagle wrote:

You might keep quiet about a hit and run if you loaned your car to a friend and she hit a pedestrian, left the scene, and maybe the pedestrian might not live.
And you might keep quiet if you loaned your car to a friend who was impaired and then she struck and maybe killed someone crossing the street.
But in neither case would you have a rock solid reason to fear being arrested by the police for having been the DRIVER of the car when it hit the pedestrian.

This is why I add a particular emotoinal bond between MM and X in my version of this hypothesis, that for her would have conjured more complex emotoins post notification that X had hit someone. Worrying about affect of exposed affair on Rausch and dad would have been a factor too.

All speculation.

Beagle wrote:

<quoted text>
I would just like to know why you think it was well reasoned and worthy of consideration. Not being a wise guy or a vain wise guy, just interested in hearing your reasons, that's all. Thanks.

Nothing beyond agreement. But I will think about it more. I think my previous posts perhaps have stated many things consistent with the opinion in question, so it seemed superfluous to repeat.

Dawn wrote:

No you cant give that information due to priavacy laws. A subpeona would be required to Maura's phone company - they would identify the incoming caller - determine - landline/cell/payphone - then would need an additional subpeona to release that information - that person would be contacted as well. Makes no sense - and who cares that the londonderry tower carried the call - that does not mean they were close to it. they hand off from tower to tower - and it says its a sprint tower - so now the other caller had sprint to.. sounds good on paper but in reality it doesn't work that way. You can be more than 20 miles ( 22 is from wikapedia site) from a site to use that site. Here in Seattle you can pick up victoria bc on a clear day on the waterfront and that is 120 + maybe more miles away. wireless is line of sight so anything can happen... what does happen is all documented though.

Thanks for the explanation. That helps. So, to rephrase just to make sure I get it: the phone company would not volunteer any info without a subpeona, but even if subpoenaed, they would not have records on which tower was the first to transmit the call?

Your tag says Omaha so I did not know you are from Seattle. That is where I went to law school. LOVELY beautiful awesome city.

Dawn wrote:

Just because a call went through the londonderry tower - the person could have been calling from peru - and it happened that maura was by that tower - now her phone received the call via the londonderry tower - better chance of winning the lottery IMHO than to get info like that

But LE said the call originated within a 20 mile radius of Londonderry !?!