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Anne
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Bill, I have said this before, the initial search AT THE SCENE was exactly as I would expect it to be. I have acknowleged that cars slide off the road all the time up here. It is common. I have a problem after family arrived and they were not listened to or given the compassion and consideration about personal knowlege of Maura. It seems like they were quickly dismissed with comments to media and public that she ran away or committed suicide. This is the crux (IMHO) of where the lack of communication originated. Fred Murray reacted with fear and anger, who would blame him? It was many months before he responded with his suit. He only asked for the most basic information, accident reports, etc. It has turned into an embroiled, exaggerated battle that continues to swirl unabated to this day! We all have responsibility in this tragic failure in communication and we all bear fault for the injustices that lie herein.
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Suzanne
Hingham, MA
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WTF-the-original wrote: <quoted text>
Things that were stated could very well still be true since we have no idea when or if Maura is missing because we have found nothing to indicate what happened to her or where it happened and if something did happen if it was by her own design or bad judgment.
I am really curious at what point does it no longer becomes NH LE’s fault and becomes Maura’s fault? I mean since so many are interested in assigning blame. If we find that she made it to Lincoln, is it still those officers fault that we don’t know where she is? What if she managed to get into the woods undetected to commit suicide or died accidentally, is that still their fault? At what point does any of this responsibility shift from everyone else to Maura?
You keep pitching them and I’ll keep hitting them.
Bill I agree and my point that I have been trying to make is that your very insightful post would not have been allowed on the first ( the FIT) forum.
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FOCUS
Readville, MA
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Suzanne wrote: <quoted text>
Opinion = My use of the word garbage. Fact = All discussion of Amherst was discouraged. There was strong unanimous agreement that 1. SBD was bad 2.CW was bad 3.CE was bad 4. All NH LE was bad 5. FBI would be able to solve this case 6. FM was absolutely perfect in every way. I could go on and on. And please spare me your resume, I was only responding to your schoolmarmish criticism. Unanimous = being of one mind, all ageeing, without exception. In the 4 years that I've been actively following Maura's disappearce, I know of many who would disagree with your assessment outlined above. Why is it, folks, that personalities can't be set aside and the task of finding Maura and bringing her home be focused on? Stop all the dang nit pickin! It's a waste of everyone's time and energy. Now back to finding Maura!
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Beagle
Amherst, MA
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Judged:
1
Advocator wrote: <quoted text>superannuated ego-maniacs aka old farts? You have something against old farts?
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Beagle
Amherst, MA
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FireCat wrote: <quoted text>
I'm not tooting my own horn. Obviously true, since you are still toothing your own horn.
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Beagle
Amherst, MA
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FireCat wrote: Oh...Beagle...the Soup Nazi is a Seinfeld character.(thought I may be the only American on the planet to have never watched an episode of it; apparently you haven't either? This encourages me to know I'm not alone....) Wow, you're more naive than I thought. Thanks for the tip.
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Beagle
Amherst, MA
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Snowy White wrote: <quoted text>
to add to the list...son-in-law takes mine, thinking it's his, and has to mail it back.
and
generally speaking, more smarts may correlate with less common sense ;-) There's that code phrase "common sense" again.
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Beagle
Amherst, MA
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Judged:
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Suzanne wrote: <quoted text>
Duh! Of course it's subjective, of course it's my opinion. What else could it possibly be? Do you want to compare credentials? Where have you been published? Do I have to write IMO, IMHO, MOO after every post? Thus contributing to my carpal tunnel syndrome? Well, maybe the mooooo part could stay. They do like cattle car thinking.
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Anne
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Beagle wrote: <quoted text>aka old farts? You have something against old farts? Beagle, the truth is at least you have a sense of humor!
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Suzanne
Hingham, MA
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Beagle wrote: <quoted text>
where he remained in a coma for an unknown length of time - at least a couple of days, probably longer.(Ahem.) Aphrodite Vasi said her son Petrit Vasi was in a coma for 2 months. Petrit Vasi says ditto. Petrit woke from his coma in April. Aphrodite states that Amherst LE never investigated her son's hit and run. In fact Amherst LE prefer to think of it as a 'possible hit and run or a car surfing.' Car surfing is this something people do in the Pioneer Valley? Because they sure don't do it around here. But maybe it's common in Amherst?
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Anne
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Suzanne, I cannot understand Amherst LE never investigating the Vasi hit and run. That is totally wrong! Did the sc hool investigate?
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Beagle
Amherst, MA
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Judged:
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sophie bean wrote: Snowy, I always respect your opinion and how clearly and calmly you state it. I do think that the 5/11 tragedy in Franconia galvanized many who feel poorly served by NH LE. Since I don't live in the area (and since I am not, in case I haven't mentioned it in the last ten seconds, related to ANYONE in Grafton County to my knowledge), I don't know that much about the truth of LE in that part of NH.
I do not believe that Shack is trying to convey a blanket condemnation of area residents. I believe that she is saying, as I have often done, that there is clearly a criminal element in the area - as evidenced by the murders of Chris Gray and Mr Powell - which is very dangerous and which is, for whatever reason, not being addressed by NH LE or, apparently, local residents. This criminal element - which I don't perceive as very different than you could find in any area with a similar degree of urban poverty (and I DO know about that)- is a danger to the local residents more than anyone else. I am still baffled as to why locals who must see this element are so enraged about it being mentioned.
Rather recently, and I'm not sure whether it was here or on another NH discussion, I raised the question about NH's several hundred autonomous SWAT teams. For a supposedly Libertarian state, I find that fact shocking and frightening - yet NH residents appear to be comfortable with it. One of the only responses I got was "well, they mostly do search & rescue."
Excuse me?
SWAT = Special Weapons and Tactics
Search and Rescue = self-explanatory
HARDLY the same thing.
VT SP, when asked about it, said that they have A (single) SWAT team of trained VSP officers.
This is precisely the sort of thing that makes some of us look at NH LE with a questioning eye. Throw in elements like the so-called "HPD 1" - a rusted, not professional-looking vehicle - and I can't help but wondering about the professionalism of some aspects of NH LE.
Scarzina's comments to the media, almost immediately after they started the belated search for Maura, were unprofessional, prejudicial, and uninformed. He has not, to my knowledege, ever backed down from those outrageous, unproven statements.
These are not merely the ravings of a few overwrought people seeing a problem where there is none. I agree about the excessive number of SWAT teams in some places. There was even one in the very small (MA) town next to mine - a town so small they had only one or two full time officers, the chief and a sergeant. A town so small they had no overnight coverage. Emergency? Call the Chief at home. But... they had a SWAT team! Why? Grants. Federal and state grants. Almost the entire department consisted of local people who put in a few hours a week for the part-time income. But with government grant money, they got all this gear, paid training time, and a good reason to have automatic weapons with them - just in case they needed 900 rounds a minute to euthanize a struck deer. Good work if you can get it. Excessive stuff like this usually means grant money. Which usually goes to people who complain the loudest about welfare cheats. How about some grant money for finding out what happened to Maura Murray?
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Beagle
Amherst, MA
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Judged:
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Mason wrote: <quoted text>
Freezer of pot??????? Yes, freezer of pot. As an example of... in some cases it's easier to dispose of a body than it is to move a lot of drugs or whatever. And yes, small to medium amounts of high grade marijuana is often kept in bulk freezers. Which why they call it refer. And that's no madness.
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Suzanne
Hingham, MA
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Anne wrote: Suzanne, I cannot understand Amherst LE never investigating the Vasi hit and run. That is totally wrong! Did the sc hool investigate? I don't believe it would be jurisdictionally appropriate for the school to investigate, it did not occur on school property.
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Beagle
Amherst, MA
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Suzanne wrote: <quoted text>
Opinion = My use of the word garbage. Fact = All discussion of Amherst was discouraged. There was strong unanimous agreement that 1. SBD was bad 2.CW was bad 3.CE was bad 4. All NH LE was bad 5. FBI would be able to solve this case 6. FM was absolutely perfect in every way. I could go on and on. And please spare me your resume, I was only responding to your schoolmarmish criticism. Johnny Most would be proud! "She dribbles. She shoots. She SCORES!"
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Beagle
Amherst, MA
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Anne wrote: <quoted text>
Suzanne are you serious? Shack is the easiest person to listen to on this forum. She is honest, sincere and totally forthright. If I disagree with some of her statements, she is one of few whom listens! She is biased in many ways, but isn't that what a public forum is about? I do not understand the consistant attack against her. For me personally Beagle drives me crazy, but I follow his posts and I check out what he has to say, because in the end, anyone involved with finding what happened to Maura bears at least civility. Sorry Beagle, I didn't start this comment with yuo in mind! That's okay. It's comforting to know I'm never far from your thoughts on the subject.
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Anne
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what a dilema, school cannot investigate and we're not positive she was in Haverhill. SBD couldn't keep the truth straight. CW remembers months later. NH LE says she either committed suicide or ran away. FBI needs to be invited and isn't. It sure seems to me there is enough reason for us all to learn to communicate better.
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Beagle
Amherst, MA
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Anne wrote: Bill, I have said this before, the initial search AT THE SCENE was exactly as I would expect it to be. I have acknowleged that cars slide off the road all the time up here. It is common. I have a problem after family arrived and they were not listened to or given the compassion and consideration about personal knowlege of Maura. It seems like they were quickly dismissed with comments to media and public that she ran away or committed suicide. This is the crux (IMHO) of where the lack of communication originated. Not quite. Who was HPD talking to between the time the car was discovered and the time they first talked to Fred? How about UMass PD? Because even though the car was registered in Fred's name, the sticker was current. It was a 2003-2004 school year sticker. You don't have to show a vehicle registration when you get a parking sticker? It would have taken HPD or NHSP about two seconds conversation with UMass PD to figure out who was driving the car. Plenty of student cars are registered in the parents' names, but driven by the student. I highly doubt the parking sticker was issued to Fred, not Maura. If it hadn't been for that conversation, or maybe one with Hanson, Whitman, or Weymouth PDs, their relationship might have been a little sunnier from the start. Remember, the Corolla had already been looked at inch by inch in North Amherst. But, and this could be very important, the Corolla was towed to the hotel, and if the Corolla was insured by Arbelle, which is a very popular vehicle insurer here in Mass., located next to Weymouth in Quincy, then the adjuster cold have walked to the car in about 30 seconds. Literally. I've seen it done before at that very location. The Amherst chrono here is Corolla is smashed. Corolla towed to hotel. Corolla possibly looked at by adjuster Sunday or early Monday at Hadley hotel. Corolla towed to North Amherst. Corolla inspected with great interest and detail by LE at North Amherst. HPD and NHSP had plenty of time to talk with MA LE before they ever talked with Fred.
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Beagle
Amherst, MA
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Suzanne wrote: <quoted text>
I don't believe it would be jurisdictionally appropriate for the school to investigate, it did not occur on school property. Maybe. It's quite possible that even though Vasi was found off-campus, that there was some indication that he was injured ON-campus. In which case UMass PD wold be the right agency to investigate. Suppose, for example, that Vasi was hazed to unconsciousness and instead of calling the cops because that would get the frat bounced from campus, the frat brothers simply dragged him to an off-campus location. That's only an example, similar in a way to the freezer of pot example. But it's definitely NOT TRUE that APD did not investigate the Vasi hit. Totally untrue.
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FireCat
United States
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Suzanne wrote: <quoted text>
Opinion = My use of the word garbage. Fact = All discussion of Amherst was discouraged. There was strong unanimous agreement that 1. SBD was bad 2.CW was bad 3.CE was bad 4. All NH LE was bad 5. FBI would be able to solve this case 6. FM was absolutely perfect in every way. I could go on and on. And please spare me your resume, I was only responding to your schoolmarmish criticism. Hah....I think that's the first time I've *ever* been called a "schoolmarm". And I still don't agree with your perception of the "facts" as you see them.
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