Where is MAURA MURRAY

BeagleBart wrote:

<quoted text>Please explain what?

Please explain what you meant by Tetra Tech. I've got no idea, no frame of reference, and I'm probably not the only one. What up with that?

Incidentally, our posts crossed in the etherspace again, and I see you've apologized. I should do likewise. Sometimes it's hard to tell when someone's being deliberately obtuse and when someone has simply overlooked someone (see my above post for example)

I'd extend the peace pipe, but that would probably have UMass crawling up your ass for possession......

FireCat wrote:

<quoted text>
I have no idea what this is supposed to mean, and I suspect I'm not alone. Please explain?

I'm glad you suspect that you're not alone,b ut please don't be paranoid. What does not being alone have to do with understanding a two-word phrase?

What if only one person - one person all alone in Mongolia - one person who never posted on any forum in the world knew that it meant something wonderful... Would you deny that person the opportunity to cherish and value it forever in cyberspace?

BeagleBart wrote:

Just so I've got this right, do you think it is a fact that Maura disappeared from Haverhill? Do you think it is a fact that Maura disappeared from Amherst? What is a good working definition of a - for lack of a better term - a disappearing place? The place of the disappearance? Something like that'

I think the last place Maura was RELIABLY seen was on whatever video they have at the liquor store and the bank in Amherst.

I think the last place Maura's car was RELIABLY seen was in Haverhill some hours later.

I don't know (honestly) what to make of the bus driver's announcement that he saw Maura but she looked "different." Was he honestly duped? Was the accident staged? Was the whole drive to Haverhill staged? I have no idea. None. Zip, zero, zilch, nada.

I *do* believe the investigators who maintain that the so-called "second" accident (where her car was retrieved from) was staged, because I trust the investigators and their outcomes. But I don't know what that means in the long run. Do we look for Maura in Amherst or Haverhill? I don't know. My instinct says Haverhill, but that doesn't mean I'm right, or that events in Amherst may or may not have bearing in how she (or her car) ended up in NH.

Does the fact that the second accident was staged mean the first one wasn't? Was Maura in the car on her way to NH? I don't know this either. Someon (philip?) suggested that because she appears on the video at the liquor store and ATM alone, that she was not under duress. That seems to make sense, at least until we know otherwise.

I just don't know. There are so few facts. And so few of them fit together in a coherent way.

Why does anyone who reads something written in an online forum insist that he or she must be able to grasp or "own" the meaning of the words written by another?

Why is word ownership such a vastly more important topic on this board than the putative one of finding Maura Murray?

Why is bickering the primary mode of exchange in online forums like this one?

Is Maura's disappearance merely the "vehicle" for the bickering over who has primary ownership of the English language?

Almost nobody - zero, no one - in the entire world reads this forum. A few people here and there, yes, they pass through. There are a few lurkers, yes. But the posts on this forum represent less than a short conversation among a few total strangers on a street corner none of them have ever stood on before nor will again.

But taken so very, very seriously, as if it really meant something. As if it would really find Maura Murray.

"It is a tale told by an idiot full of sound and fury, signifying nothing." WS

BeagleBart wrote:

What if only one person - one person all alone in Mongolia - one person who never posted on any forum in the world knew that it meant something wonderful... Would you deny that person the opportunity to cherish and value it forever in cyberspace?

Then you should email them with this phrase, not post it on a public forum, which I thought was to help us understand and gather information together.

Doing what I do for a living, I would never deny the English language to anyone; the concept of ownership is, of course, ridiculous. Although I doubt anyone in Mongolia who doesn't have access to this or any other forum would likely understand your two-word post; rather that it was intended for someone specific, for the rest of us to misunderstand and for that one person alone to grasp the full meaning.

Enough dissembling. I'm proud that you can quote Shakespeare. Yippee. What does it have to do with Maura? Sound and fury signifying nothing? "Tetra tech." Three pages of posts regarding things that the average poster cannot--and was not meant to--understand.

FireCat wrote:

<quoted text>
I think the last place Maura was RELIABLY seen was on whatever video they have at the liquor store and the bank in Amherst.
I think the last place Maura's car was RELIABLY seen was in Haverhill some hours later.
I don't know (honestly) what to make of the bus driver's announcement that he saw Maura but she looked "different." Was he honestly duped? Was the accident staged? Was the whole drive to Haverhill staged? I have no idea. None. Zip, zero, zilch, nada.
I *do* believe the investigators who maintain that the so-called "second" accident (where her car was retrieved from) was staged, because I trust the investigators and their outcomes. But I don't know what that means in the long run. Do we look for Maura in Amherst or Haverhill? I don't know. My instinct says Haverhill, but that doesn't mean I'm right, or that events in Amherst may or may not have bearing in how she (or her car) ended up in NH.
Does the fact that the second accident was staged mean the first one wasn't? Was Maura in the car on her way to NH? I don't know this either. Someon (philip?) suggested that because she appears on the video at the liquor store and ATM alone, that she was not under duress. That seems to make sense, at least until we know otherwise.
I just don't know. There are so few facts. And so few of them fit together in a coherent way.

I am posting this again, because it gets to the root of what I think. If you can't get past whatever agenda you seem to have tonight, good an' yer. THIS is why I'm here. Not to dissemble, not to argue. Maura is not a vehicle for anything. Maura is an end to herself. I will not rest until I find her, and neither will her family.

Again, when you're done pissing up ropes, which you continue to do despite all apologies given, rendered, or received, that's where I'll be. Looking for Maura, in any way I am able.

FireCat wrote:

<quoted text>
I think the last place Maura was RELIABLY seen was on whatever video they have at the liquor store and the bank in Amherst.
I think the last place Maura's car was RELIABLY seen was in Haverhill some hours later.
I don't know (honestly) what to make of the bus driver's announcement that he saw Maura but she looked "different." Was he honestly duped? Was the accident staged? Was the whole drive to Haverhill staged? I have no idea. None. Zip, zero, zilch, nada.
I *do* believe the investigators who maintain that the so-called "second" accident (where her car was retrieved from) was staged, because I trust the investigators and their outcomes. But I don't know what that means in the long run. Do we look for Maura in Amherst or Haverhill? I don't know. My instinct says Haverhill, but that doesn't mean I'm right, or that events in Amherst may or may not have bearing in how she (or her car) ended up in NH.
Does the fact that the second accident was staged mean the first one wasn't? Was Maura in the car on her way to NH? I don't know this either. Someon (philip?) suggested that because she appears on the video at the liquor store and ATM alone, that she was not under duress. That seems to make sense, at least until we know otherwise.
I just don't know. There are so few facts. And so few of them fit together in a coherent way.

I'm not being a pain (sorry to disappoint), but this summary of "facts" is pretty accurate and well described. It's about the same as was known four plus years ago. After how many posts? Is is possible that the posts - the forums - are the problem? Is it possible that an actual, real-world disappearance has become an interactive, online, video game of sorts? One where the posters sort of plot their own "script" as it moves along?

Lettuce in the fifth.

"Looking for Maura" is way different from finding her. "Looking for Maura" is an endless soap opera. It has no end. It cannot, by its very nature allow an end. It must remain circular. The very idea of an end is terrifying to those who perpetuate the myth of looking for her.

Hello all,

As you can see I feel unable to quite let go of this forum. Not at all very principled of me, I´m sure...

Being an inveterate night-owl I just checked in here before checking out for today (or rather tonight!)
Indeed the sun will pretty soon be rising here again after a mere four or five hours of semi-darkness in the Swedish summer night.

A quick response to looking4amoose´s question (post # 2730):

As far as I recall from the old MMM forum, Maura and her family used to camp at the Jigger Johnson Campground in the White Mountains, which according to the web information is to be found on the Rt112/Kancamagus Highway about halfway between Lincoln and Conway.
I´ve never seen any references anywhere as for Maura and/or her family having any kind of connection to the area between Haverhill and Lincoln.

As for Maura (if it was indeed Maura) choosing the 112 instead of the better 302, I believe I mentioned in a post quite some time ago that I found a web site for a motel in the Woodstock/Lincoln area which rather surprisingly advises its clients to drive the 112 from Haverhill to Woodstock/Lincoln rather than the 302 and I-93 south if arriving from the I-91 direction.
What if Maura had this motel in mind for the night if she indeed was the driver of the Saturn?

Euro.....wish I knew.....of course the problem is that no one knows for sure where Maura was even TRYING to go.

Hi Firecat. You are indeed not alone. The random "reference" (can you call something a reference when it refers, intentionally, to nothing?) of "Tetra Tech" was completely baffling and nonsensical to me as well.

Three full pages of arguing about what it really means to "disappear from" somewhere. For the love of Pete, how absurd is that?

Simple logic - it is agreed that the last place we know Maura was for a fact was Amherst. It is also agreed, I hope, that Maura's car was found in Haverhill. May I also point out that her car IS NOT in Haverhill now, nor has it been to my knowledge since it was found. The car, to my knowledge, is and has been outside of the fence at the NHSP barracks in Twin Mountain, a good 15 miles from Haverhill.

I am getting really very tired of being accused of "attacking" or "harassing" NH residents. I have said, and Shack has said, more times than I can count, that we ONLY have contempt and anger for the perpetrators if any, and those who are knowingly and willingly protecting such perps. By that, I and I believe Shack do not have any particular individuals in mind - it is a general statement, entirely unlike those of "Oh My." I would be far less interested in Bath, Haverhill, NH LE, if they weren't acting so squirrely.
To threaten with arrest people looking for a friend or relative where the car was found is bizarre.

I am not aware of anyone acting this squirrely on the Mass end. I have never once, however, ruled out looking at Amherst etc. It happens to not be where I'm looking, period. There's no reason, either, not to look along the whole I-91 corridor.

For what it's worth, I didn't see anyone on MMM, including myself "trying to steer discussion away from" the reported sightings in VT or NH. I agree that there wasn't much discussion of them, but that's a long, long way from having a sekrit agenda to stifle such discussion.

One thing that is not being discussed here is the fact that directions on the north end of I-91 can be very tricky. IF there's a sign on 302 that says 302 straight, 112 right, it would be entirely possible to misread it and get on 112 by mistake. I've gotten lost on roads around Littleton, Woodsville, Bath etc plenty of times - it's easy to do, and I'm pretty familiar with the area.

FireCat wrote:

<quoted text>Three pages of posts regarding things that the average poster cannot--and was not meant to--understand.

You speak for them, do you? Are those you refer to something like share-croppers in your cotton fields of English? Do they buy your brand of understanding from your classroom company store? And you are telling me that you know what the average poster - and, implicitly, lurker - can and cannot understand? You sure seem to.

And that's an attempt to control the discourse. To wrestle it away from anyone who implies an instability in the very notion of possessing and controlling and owning the language. When you start saying what other people do and do not understand about a little skirmish of posts, you are saying that you speak for them, that they, in effect, are yours. That they belong to you. They are your people.

This is the economy of slavery. It has the same foundation. It aspires to the same kind of hierarchical control over dissident and subversive expression.

The story of Maura Murray's disappearance is, sadly, like so many others, a commodity in the economy of controlling how people think about a certain kind of injustice.

Molly Bish and Maura Murray have had the benefit of more search dogs than were used investigatively in over fifty racist bombings in this country between the end of World War Two and the mid 1960's. Invisible inner city kids disappear almost every week in this country without a trace and without a tracker. Without even a paragraph in a newspaper. Yet there is plenty of time to use an attractive white woman to honor our own heroic use of an internet discussion board. There is plenty of time for puffing up our armchair heroics.

In four and a half years all these questions have yielded nothing. Maura Murray was last seen in Amherst. Her father's car was abandoned in Haverhill. And that's about it.

Oh yeah, cabbage in the sixth.

Sophie, LOL at "sekrit" agenda.

I will not even go into shrecropping, modern slavery and its economy, injustice, andt he number of search dogs used for Maura. It is an insult both to Maura, and to the victims of modern slavery (of whom there are more than 246 million, at latest count, under the age of 14.) So don't even mother-freaking go there, Alden. Just don't.

There is no agenda here, other than to FIND MAURA.

I have an early class tomorrow. Good night, sophster. Good night, all.

Don't forget cabbage in the sixth, FireCat.

Sophie..Thank you....YES !!!

BB Yardi yardi Blah blah

FireCat wrote:

So don't even mother-freaking go there, Alden. Just don't.

There is no agenda here...

Okay, if you say so.

Eurobserver wrote:

Hello all,
As far as I recall from the old MMM forum, Maura and her family used to camp at the Jigger Johnson Campground in the White Mountains, which according to the web information is to be found on the Rt112/Kancamagus Highway about halfway between Lincoln and Conway.
I´ve never seen any references anywhere as for Maura and/or her family having any kind of connection to the area between Haverhill and Lincoln.
As for Maura (if it was indeed Maura) choosing the 112 instead of the better 302, I believe I mentioned in a post quite some time ago that I found a web site for a motel in the Woodstock/Lincoln area which rather surprisingly advises its clients to drive the 112 from Haverhill to Woodstock/Lincoln rather than the 302 and I-93 south if arriving from the I-91 direction.
What if Maura had this motel in mind for the night if she indeed was the driver of the Saturn?

Jigger Johnson is only accessible during the late spring (mud season), summer and fall--it is a state operated "no facilities" campground and is on the Kancamagus Highway. There is no way she was headed there with no heavily insulated heavily heated trailer. To the best of my knowledge, she didn't even pack a sleeping bag! She would know better, even if she wasn't thinking sensibly. If the motel you mention is in Woodstock or Lincoln, yes the person could go 112 because the 302 route could be much longer, but the Kancamagus is a whole different world in the winter (even in the summer at times) than the eastern part of 112 like Haverhill to Woodstock. Many of the motels and even restaurants in Lincoln and Woodstock aren't even open in the winter unless they are very close to Loon Mountain where they will get the skiing crowd.

BeagleBart wrote:

<quoted text>
Okay, if you say so.

"Here" of course, being defined as from where *I* type. I cannot speak for others, as you continually remind me.