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FireCat
United States
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Ben Franklin wrote: First - I was mistaken on this - modified for clarity:
"But her directions however are a map to [the car staging] location."
I believe that I have read elsewhere that the directions in her car were to Bennington, Vermont - not where the car was found. Yes. That's one of the (smaller) mysteries. We don't know why Maura--or at least her car--ended up in Haverhill AT ALL. So either she drove or someone that knew she frequented there drove after the crime. I'm corn-fused about this statement. Was that part of your original assessment that's now revised on learning the directions weren't to there? Meep meep Heh. Nice.
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Joined: May 15, 2008
Comments: 140
Medway, MA
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Question re Maura being held captive, possibly in a rental house with carpet that Shack said had menstrual blood stains in a closet: How long after suddenly stopping birth control pills (e.g., due to abduction and imprisonment) does it take for the person to begin to menstruate? Is the blood in the closet related to the pills left untaken in the Saturn? Was she held captive for days? This is a horror. Seems the PI team agrees it wasn't Maura in the Saturn (height, hair); the car purposefully wasn't dumped on federal property (you'd think mostly cops or criminals would be aware of that); there was an earlier accident 1-3 miles from the Saturn with overhang damage to Saturn; Maura was no longer free after that accident. Maybe "Oh My" said a few things worth reviewing about the Valley Road rental, the renter's girlfriend's behavior after Maura went missing, the renter's brother's pinpointing the murderer and providing a knife to Fred, etc. etc. Sounds like the PIs know what happened but just need more information from what local residents may have overheard to have enough evidence.
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Joined: Jun 16, 2008
Comments: 472
Södertälje, Sweden
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Judged:
1
Ben Franklin, Welcome to this forum and I´m sure we all look forward to your input here! As for your recent comments, I believe that Maura, prior to leaving Amherst, looked up directions for Stowe/Burlington,VT, the Berkshires of western MA and the Bartlett area of NH, which she knew well and loved from many family holidays in that region. If she indeed intended to travel all the way from Amherst, MA, to the Bartlett area of NH, she could well have chosen to drive Rte 112 from Woodsville via Lincoln/North Woodstock, and continuing eastwards on the Kancamagus Highway (the eastern section of NH 112) via Conway to Bartlett. In the winter I have been told that people are advised to drive the far better US 302 from Woodsville via Littleton and Bretton Woods to Bartlett, but Maura may well have been unaware of this information as she apparently didn´t know the western parts of NH very well. If Maura´s plan was to stay overnight at a motel or in a cabin somewhere in the Lincoln/North Woodstock area she could also easily have ended up on Rte 112. Actually some of the lodging establishments in the Lincoln/Woodstock area advice their clients to drive that particular route if arriving from western MA and/or southern VT. There are so many various possibilites and alternatives in Maura´s case wherever one looks. Separating fact from fiction and suppositions is certainly no easy task here.
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FireCat
United States
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Quija wrote: How long after suddenly stopping birth control pills .... does it take for the person to begin to menstruate? The short answer to that is "whenever your body darn well feels like it." So.....yes, it is possible, depending on where in the cycle one's body is. Spotting, full-out menstrual period, what have you. And that, like me personally or not, happens to be a fact, folks.
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sophie bean
South Gardiner, ME
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Wowzer wrote: <quoted text>
When innocent people are accused "by name and or address" on a forum open to the public to being involved in some way to the disappearance of a young women with absolutely no evidence that a crime was even committed then I would consider that a witch hunt. Thank you, Wowzer, for proving my point. No "innocent people" have been "accused" of anything, least of all being involved in a crime by ANYONE who has been involved in the MMM forum. No "innoent people" have been accused of "being involved with the disappearance" of Maura. It is already perfectly clear that you don't give a hoot for facts, don't care in the least if Maura is ever found, and only want to remove any attention from your little corner of the world. If anyone feels "compelled" to leave because I don't want them ranting about CK here, then they should indeed leave, by all means. The option of totally ignoring me obviously exists, since I neither have nor want any "authority" here, exactly as it should be. Obviously, you don't want us to continue our search for Maura. Obviously, many of us don't care, and will continue to search. Weeper - hi Weeper! thanks for posting!- has said as clearly as possible that LE views this as a homicide investigation. Not an "adult runaway" - not "suicide" - not "accidental death." As Shack has said, it's good to know that there IS an investigation, though incredibly chilling to see "homicide." As I said last week, LE would not try to get, or actually obtain, a search warrant unless there was significant evidence of a crime. There is no reason that they would need to release such information to the public in an ongoing investigation. Now, once again, Weeper has thanked local people for their assistance and support. All of us "MM insiders" (how absurd!) have said the same thing many times, though it appears to go unnoticed by the critics. We have said time and time and time again that we are only "after" the perpetrators and their accomplices if there ARE any. Honestly, since I have never once "accused" a local (or anyone else) of anything like a crime, I think I'm done being an "apologist" for searching for Maura. I see the criticism as merely the distraction that it's intended to be - "leave us locals alone, go away!" Pffft indeed.
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gvmeabrk
Weare, NH
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BEAGLE BART>>>>>
Are you still around???
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Benjamin Franklin
San Jose, CA
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[QUOTE who="FireCat] I'm corn-fused about this statement. Was that part of your original assessment that's now revised on learning the directions weren't to there?
[/QUOTE]
Before I realized I made my mistake, I thought that the person who planted the scene didn't have to be very lucky or have inside/prior knowledge that she frequented that area - because I thought she had directions to there printed out, in the car.
Now I only think that it was either improbable luck that the criminal planted the car there or prior/insdide knowledge.
I am, as always, your humble Coyote, etc. &
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Benjamin Franklin
San Jose, CA
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Eurobserver wrote: Ben Franklin,
Welcome to this forum and I´m sure we all look forward to your input here!
As for your recent comments, I believe that Maura, prior to leaving Amherst, looked up directions for Stowe/Burlington,VT, the Berkshires of western MA and the Bartlett area of NH, which she knew well and loved from many family holidays in that region.
If she indeed intended to travel all the way from Amherst, MA, to the Bartlett area of NH, she could well have chosen to drive Rte 112 from Woodsville via Lincoln/North Woodstock, and continuing eastwards on the Kancamagus Highway (the eastern section of NH 112) via Conway to Bartlett.
In the winter I have been told that people are advised to drive the far better US 302 from Woodsville via Littleton and Bretton Woods to Bartlett, but Maura may well have been unaware of this information as she apparently didn´t know the western parts of NH very well.
If Maura´s plan was to stay overnight at a motel or in a cabin somewhere in the Lincoln/North Woodstock area she could also easily have ended up on Rte 112. Actually some of the lodging establishments in the Lincoln/Woodstock area advice their clients to drive that particular route if arriving from western MA and/or southern VT.
There are so many various possibilites and alternatives in Maura´s case wherever one looks.
Separating fact from fiction and suppositions is certainly no easy task here. I've read elsewhere that she was familiar with the area the car was found - not Bennington Vermont, where the directions in her car were for. Yeah she called for rooms in Bartlett, but she also called 800-GOSTOWE. By the directions being in her car, it appears that her conclusion was to go to Vermont. The best past to Stowe and Bennington diverge at Concord, New Hampshire - which is why I think some looking should be done there. As always, I am your faithful servant, etc. &
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FireCat
United States
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Benjamin Franklin wrote: <quoted text>
Before I realized I made my mistake, I thought that the person who planted the scene didn't have to be very lucky or have inside/prior knowledge that she frequented that area - because I thought she had directions to there printed out, in the car.
Now I only think that it was either improbable luck that the criminal planted the car there or prior/insdide knowledge.
I am, as always, your humble Coyote, etc. & Ahhhso, my humble Coyote. Now I get it. Thanks.:)
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Wowzer
Concord, NH
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sophie bean wrote: <quoted text>
Thank you, Wowzer, for proving my point.
No "innocent people" have been "accused" of anything, least of all being involved in a crime by ANYONE who has been involved in the MMM forum. No "innoent people" have been accused of "being involved with the disappearance" of Maura. It is already perfectly clear that you don't give a hoot for facts, don't care in the least if Maura is ever found, and only want to remove any attention from your little corner of the world.
If anyone feels "compelled" to leave because I don't want them ranting about CK here, then they should indeed leave, by all means. The option of totally ignoring me obviously exists, since I neither have nor want any "authority" here, exactly as it should be.
Obviously, you don't want us to continue our search for Maura. Obviously, many of us don't care, and will continue to search.
Weeper - hi Weeper! thanks for posting!- has said as clearly as possible that LE views this as a homicide investigation. Not an "adult runaway" - not "suicide" - not "accidental death." As Shack has said, it's good to know that there IS an investigation, though incredibly chilling to see "homicide." As I said last week, LE would not try to get, or actually obtain, a search warrant unless there was significant evidence of a crime. There is no reason that they would need to release such information to the public in an ongoing investigation.
Now, once again, Weeper has thanked local people for their assistance and support. All of us "MM insiders" (how absurd!) have said the same thing many times, though it appears to go unnoticed by the critics. We have said time and time and time again that we are only "after" the perpetrators and their accomplices if there ARE any.
Honestly, since I have never once "accused" a local (or anyone else) of anything like a crime, I think I'm done being an "apologist" for searching for Maura. I see the criticism as merely the distraction that it's intended to be - "leave us locals alone, go away!"
Pffft indeed. If no innocent people have been accused then are you saying that all that have been accused are guilty? Without naming names just about everyone at one time or another that lives in the immediate proximity of where Maura's car was found have been accused of having something to do with her disappearance. Their names were dragged through the mud over and over again. Would you like me to send you some of the things that were said that I have saved or do you want me to post them here along with the names of who said what? I never said that it was you that did the accusing. Feeling guilty are we? You are very very wrong.I really don't give a rat's behind how long you search but I truly hope that Maura is found and if someone is responsible then they are punished to the fullest extent of the law. I hope most of all though that she is found alive and well. To say I don't give a hoot for facts, don't care if Maura is ever found and I'm trying to draw attention away from my area is rude, mean and untrue. Look back at my posts. It's posts like yours that I've been trying to bring attention too as they are driving people away. From the start of this thread I've only tried to help. No longer though. This forum has become a farce, a carbon copy of the MMM forum. WTF has the right idea. Sit back and read the threads as a form of entertainment and watch as you people run in the same unending circle for another 4 years. I will start that first thing in the morning as it seems so much less stressful and I do actually enjoy cartoons. Oh and yes I thought what Weeper said was very nice. Much nicer than some of the things that have been said about the locals in the past. It will be interesting to see how many more will come and go once their replies are met with condescending attitudes and rudeness. Keep on keeping on!!! Sophie you are such a peach.:)
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“Because I can..”
Joined: May 13, 2008
Comments: 211
Kansas City, MO
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Wow it is true, some are on here just to rant (while proffessing they don't rant, they only want the truth). And others are on here to watch those rant (me personally, I have alot of theories. But I no longer get on here to comment about those. I get on here in hopes someday to find the truth is discovered.). Why do some keep bringing up that people are trying to derail an investigation(in so many words)? I have only seen two maybe three people on here in the past that have really went overboard with accusations. There are some very plausible theories here and it has been proven time after time that anything but one theory is considered going against the flow. Even a member of an ivestigative team gets on here and commends those for thinking outside the box. He gives some facts and tells people to work with those facts. And people still get railed on. IMO some of you that profess to be trying to solve the problem. Have indeed, turned into part of the problem. You have created a sisterhood or a post menopausal club, that knows no more than what can be found on the web. Please can't everyone get along? I find it saddening that some have such closed minds. And would put their feelings and strong wills above finding the truth. For those of you that have closed minds and continually bring up comments like "scroll on bye", "were here to stay", "leave", etc.. Maybe you should start a private forum so you can continue to spin your wheels and commend each other on theories you've already discussed, and talk about ducks-drinks-or whatever. On the flip side there are some that are from your old forum that are very respectable. There are one or two who have yet to rail on anyone. They are bigger people who obviously don't bring themselves to such a lower level. They must scroll on bye without telling or being told to scroll on bye. And I commend them. Like I said, I don't post much anymore, so fire away sisters...
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“Because I can..”
Joined: May 13, 2008
Comments: 211
Kansas City, MO
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You beat me to it Wowzer. You must have posted while i was typing. I would'nt have posted, you more or less got my point accross.
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none
AOL
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does any think the police were involved?
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whiston
Meriden, CT
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hi all.what if any D.N.A.or signs of a crime were all collected whilst the car was at Lavoies.that could explain why the car was left outside after it was examined.if that happened either no strange D.N.A was found or no match was on file so we can only wait for it to show up.the other option is someone close to maura that had used the car , or was with her,left D.N.A in the car.Did P.D. photograph mrMurrays car in Amherst when it was in the body shop, i dont know.if they did i am sure they took a few samples and if they did then i would bet they did the same thing with the saturn.take care philip
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elsewherebriefly
Shallotte, NC
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Possibly Maura's vehicle was staged by more than one person, maybe a man and a woman.
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whiston
Meriden, CT
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hi elsewhere and all .i think the saturn just got stuck where it got stuck.the experts say it was damaged elsewhere but i think pure chance put it there.if it was a jurisdiction issue why put it so close to a home.also this bend was known as an accident spot it had happened before ,how many times i dont know but maybe that is why nobody went to help the driver.also if there were no lights on maybe it was a little odd to anyone watching and they stayed away.take care philip
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elsewherebriefly
Shallotte, NC
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The jurisdiction issue is one that always has me thinking. I learned early on that State Troopers pretty much kept to the highways. This was before Highway patrol existed. Although I may be wrong, I think Highway Patrol was placed into commission around 2001. Each town has its own police departments and I believe this was explained in earlier postings. I was surprised to learn about the National Park falling under Federal jurisdiction. When you look at the map this is a fairly good sized area. Then we've got Highway Patrol which happened to be there that night.
Just thinking out loud.
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elsewherebriefly
Shallotte, NC
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Oh and one final thought, I know of a town in New Hampshire that only hires full time residents from within that town only on the police force. I'm dating myself and maybe things have changed but I don't think so. I always found this to be interesting to say the least.
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Joined: May 15, 2008
Comments: 140
Medway, MA
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Judged:
2
1
If what Weeper says the group of PIs believes is true (i.e., not stated to draw in someone who knows something different), then there's nothing to discuss until Maura got within 1-3 miles of the snowbank. I'm just curious what everyone's reactions are to Weeper's facts of the case which are based on an experienced group of former LE professionals. I don't know what to think.
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Joined: Jun 16, 2008
Comments: 472
Västerås, Sweden
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Benjamin Franklin,
Regarding your recent post:
As far as I know (and I´ve been reading a lot about this heartbreaking case) Maura never looked up directions for Bennington, VT, but did indeed make a search for directions to Burlington, VT, and to the nearby Stowe area.
With all due respect I believe that you must be confusing Bennington in SW Vermont with Burlington/Stowe in the NW part of Vermont.
Maura also made searches for directions for the Berkshire Ranges of NW MA and for the Bartlett area of northern New Hampshire, which she knew very well indeed.
I have never ever come across any information stating that Maura knew the area where her car was found (Haverhill, NH) at all well.
Indeed, she may not even have been in that part of NH before, for all that we know.
Please, kindly indicate where you may have found Maura´s knowledge of the Haverhill/Woodsville, NH, area to be a fact.
That would be a highly important piece of information, if you could verify this as fact.
Thanks.
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