Where is MAURA MURRAY

whiston wrote:

hi elsewhere and all .i think the saturn just got stuck where it got stuck.the experts say it was damaged elsewhere but i think pure chance put it there.if it was a jurisdiction issue why put it so close to a home.also this bend was known as an accident spot it had happened before ,how many times i dont know but maybe that is why nobody went to help the driver.also if there were no lights on maybe it was a little odd to anyone watching and they stayed away.take care philip

Hello Philip, I just want to reference your post and I'm talking to everyone. I looked at the police log/drawing. As an artist, I see a deliberate set of //(marks)\\.......it's very *simple*, basic, and so I wonder what CS really thought at that point in time when he wrote it up. I read and saw how he circled each response...... the report, I think it may even contradict itself, even vague, if you will. Right away CS says he got the call at 7 or 7:30 and yet he says it took him how many minutes to get to the Saturn? Think about it, he was close by and should also be able to recall the time of the call. Maybe he doesn't say for his own reasons. I'm not picking on him, just pointing things out really.
Why put the car so close to a home? Well, why not anyway? If it was a known accident spot, the thought could come to mind. "The car backed up parallel to the road", that's how one neighbor put it. That's how CS drew it.
CW was supposedly on the way home from work, clocking out at 7 in Franconia.
SBD was off doing a bus run.......The W-Mans were really the only ones who might "predictably" be home. I don't know.....just trying to help here.
SBD said no lights were on, neighbors said they were flashing.
SBD says he saw her from the face up because of airbags in her face AND YET, a neighbor says she *stopped* looking when she saw the SBD was there. What does that mean?
Thank you by the way to everyone for really digging into the maps and such again. I think this might matter more than we know

Sooz wrote:

<quoted text>
As I recall from the old MMM forum in a reply to me with a stated similar scenario..."Maura was never on the bus."

That wasn't really the point of what I wrote so if you like you can change it to the house instead of the bus. Does that make the theory sound better, simpler, in an Occam's razor way, compared to the alternate theory?

I was trying to give examples of complex versus simple. Needing assumptions versus scenarios that work without assumptions.

Jeff

sophie bean wrote:

As FireCat correctly points out, Lindsley has no way at all of knowing this. He didn't say "she may have" turned right on 112, or headed to Lincoln, and she was familiar with places in the White Mountains, which doesn't necessarily mean that she was familiar with Swiftwater. It is far too easy to assume that something is a fact when it is based merely on conjecture, hearsay or opinion - then the non-fact ends up in the discussion as a given. Not helpful.

"Maybe she was heading to Woodstock. I know her cell couldn't work. She knew the area like the back of her hand. She certainly knew how to survive in wilderness," Mrs. Murray said.

http://www.unionleader.com/article.aspx...

It is also obvious, given the shirt time it took her to get from the ATM to where the car was, that her car traveled directly to that point. Also since the car was on 112 but was in Amhurst earlier, the car turned on 112.

hi all .did i read that sgtSmith talked to mrAtwood through the window of the bus and never actually got on the bus.i think the accident report has more holes in it than Mel Gibsons apology the weirdest thing to me is why wait 6 days to write it when sgtSmith knew before that this was a missing persons case.maybe he did the sketch on the 9th. idont know yet.take care philip

Just saw a quick preview on TV about Maura
on "20/20" this Friday..

I'd like to give an example of complex versus simple..........
We thought it was someone who had left their car, thought it was Fred, snowmobilers do this and come back for their cars.........
Are examples like this simple or complex? Especially when you already know you're looking for an "endangered" Maura? It just seems like buying time to me, for whatever reason.

Shack, that's fantastic! Are you saying it will air this Friday the 15th?

Here's a link to the upcoming 20/20 segment with a video/picture of Maura on the front page.

http://abcnews.go.com/2020

paris wrote:

Here's a link to the upcoming 20/20 segment with a video/picture of Maura on the front page.
http://abcnews.go.com/2020

If you go to this site, and click on the "Where's Maura Murray" line under her photo at the upper right, a video will open -- advertisement first, then a brief intro and some tape of Maura's father, Bill Rausch and his mother, and Liz Drewniak. Also some photos of Maura I have personally not seen before. This is apparently a kind of "trailer" for next Friday's show.

Shack wrote:

Just saw a quick preview on TV about Maura
on "20/20" this Friday..

Woo Hoo! Thanks for the great news Shack!!

Wow Looking4amoose,

I never knew. That makes a lot of sense. This particular town had the largest herione/drug sting in the history of NH not too long ago. Just thought I'd toss that in as a useless factoid.

Sophie Bean,

302 never seems far from my thoughts, I hear ya. Great posts by the way.

Again Shack,

Thanks for the news about Maura being featured on 20/20 Friday. It is one of the shows I normally watch anyway. I know we've discussed one or two shows in the past.

Mcsmom,

Thanks for the reply re: Jurisdiction. I also wanted to let you know that I've been thinking about how Silky noted the airbag appeared to be cut away from the steering column by someone who is left handed.

Been remembering a number of your posts as well in the late.

Hello all,

Just checked out Maura´s link for the upcoming 20/20 programme.
How wonderful that her case is finally gaining some considerable media attention after such a long time in the doldrums.
Hopefully this new TV exposure will also be resulting in a lot more local and regional coverage of Maura´s case in the local and regional New England media.

http://www.youtube.com/watch...

U Tube video of a spin out...

I have been looking at police reports/sketches of single car accidents and hopefully will find the perfect example to post. When people write, draw, or sketch, you can actually "read/hear" them. I've been taught it's something related to body language. I find the accident report pretty interesting even though I've seen it before, now I'm studying it. Does anyone have the whole report though? Mail to mmm2long@yahoo.com, thanks.

elsewhere....yes. Great news about 20/20! Lets hope the show brings things into focus!!! Maybe all of our letter writing and emails paid off! Congratulations all!

Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passions, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.
And the fact, besides the one that I plagiarized the above paragraph from John Adams, is that the car traveled a distance of approximately 146 miles in between 4:37 PM when she checked her voice mail and 7:35 PM.- when the accident was reported.
Here is the police report showing 7:35 PM: http://www.mauramurraymissing.com/Documents.h...
Her checking her voice mail at 4:37 PM comes from the Hanson Express Special report, June 21, 2007, page 4, column 5, paragraph 4.
The special report also states the following:
At 3:40 PM Maura went to the ATM, then went to a local liquor store, then to get some Insurance forms found in her car.
She also packed her cell phone charger.
4:37 is just about the right time for her to leave Amherst. And if her cell phone battery was dead, she could only check voice messages after she started her car. This isn't fact, but rather, a possibility that fits nicely.
Two hours, 58 minutes to travel 146 miles.
An average travel speed from that point in time of 49.16 miles an hour.
Give some time for getting gas and being abducted, and she is consistently going over 50 miles an hour.
Fact: She traveled in a straight line up Interstate 91.

End of Part I

[quote=who"sophie bean"]
Do you know for a fact where Maura was when she checked her voice mail, if in fact she did?[/quote]

Since this is a speculative research forum with intent to construct a theory, and not a court of law, it boggles the mind that anyone would ever approach a disagreement in such an manner inappropriate to research.

[quote=who"sophie bean"]Do you know for a fact how fast she was driving, if she made any stops enroute, where Maura stopped driving? No.[/quote]

Mathematically there are limits to what is possible. So yes.:)

[quote=who"sophie bean"]The search could start in White River Junction. It could - and should, in my opinion, start at Umass, and include any and all points between there and Swiftwater.[/quote]

Good we agree on something. What we don't agree on is what has been searched already. If you familiarize yourself with the case, you will find out that Amherst and the Swiftwater area have already been checked. I have heard nothing about White River Junction.

[quote=who"sophie bean"] Furthermore, I-91 is the most obvious route to Wells River (NOT, however, to Swiftwater) but it is far from the only route, or even the only reasonable route. Rt 10 from Hanover goes to Woodsville. Rt 5 in VT goes to Wells River.[/quote]

Note the mathematical reality above. It isolates from what her reasonable choices could have been to what they likely were.

[quote=who"sophie bean"] Again, the "Occams Razor" theory of "the most obvious solution is correct" is swell when it is corret, not so swell when it isn't.[/quote]

Sophie - I don't know what your purpose is here. Your message gives me little reason to take you seriously. I don't see any purpose of your message besides causing diversion, creating arguments and chasing people away. That's why I no longer take you seriously nor will I spend any more effort on these efforts.

I was, and always was your faithful and humble servant, etc &

Part III

[quote=who"sopie bean"] Again, these are assumptions which you are stating as facts. It takes "2 hrs 47 mins" to get where? and from where?[/quote]
Prior to your post, I supplied a map - and I do so again: http://maps.google.com/maps...
That is the obvious where to where I was referring to.
Alternatively, lets consider the possibility that she took Interestate 93:
http://maps.google.com/maps...
As you can see, this travel is a distance of 190 miles.
Two hours, 58 minutes to travel 190 miles.
An average speed of 64.18 miles an hour, but 1/3 of the travel on a two lane road that is dangerous to travel on at that speed.
Note the police report I supplied in this post. Note that it states the car was found at the intersection of Bradley Hill Road and Highway 112 AKA Wild Ammonoosuc Road. That is where both maps end.
And on both maps, appear different names for nearby towns, that different newspapers have attributed to being the accident site. Swiftwater, Woodsville, Haverhill, Lincoln. This creates a lot of confusion as to what direction she was traveling. What areas she was familiar with. Some reports imply the car was found East of Interstate 93!
[quote="sophie bean"] and she was familiar with places in the White Mountains, which doesn't necessarily mean that she was familiar with Swiftwater.[/quote]
The White Mountains encompass an area larger then the national forest. If you want to know where the White Mountains are, you can consult this page: http://www.visitwhitemountains.com/getting-he...
And you will find Swiftwater within those bounds.
As always, I am your faithful and humble servant, etc. &
[quote=who"sophie bean"] As FireCat correctly points out, Lindsley has no way at all of knowing this.[/quote]
We indeed do, mathematics tell us.
[quote=who"sophie bean"] He didn't say "she may have" turned right on 112, or headed to Lincoln, It is far too easy to assume that something is a fact when it is based merely on conjecture, hearsay or opinion - then the non-fact ends up in the discussion as a given. Not helpful.[/quote]
Thats because the unstated alternative you assert, is impossible.
[quote=who"sophie bean"] Honestly, I don't recall having seen posts from those who know Maura saying explicitly that she was familiar with / had stayed in Lincoln/Woodstock or even Bartlett.
[/quote]
Very common knowledge. Two times I have posted examples here, that I retrieved in a simple Google search. I barely looked at them, the hits were abundant.
[quote=who"sophie bean"]Even if she was familiar with those areas and had stayed there, I'm not sure what that proves or attempts to prove.[/quote]
I won't repeat myself. I've posted the logic before.

Part III should have been II, II, should have been three.