Where is MAURA MURRAY

Part 2
Regardless of the reason as to why she was asked to leave WP (if she was asked to leave at all), she probably would have felt ashamed. Considering her competitive nature, she may have been genuinely crestfallen. Furthermore, if her father showed any disappointment in her, it may have caused a great deal of angst, and a great deal of sadness in her. This in itself may have been enough to warrant a downward spiral into... I don't know, mental illness (maybe), alcoholism (maybe). So this downward spiral is occurring parallel to her stint in nursing school, which she probably isn't really enjoying anyway. It’s already been reported that she didn’t have many friends. In my mind, nursing school was a back-up or fall-back plan anyway. Something didn't go right at West Point, and now she is doing this other thing, and probably not liking it very much. Now she’s closer to her family (in terms of distance), but she is further away from her boyfriend (and seriously folks, if they were engaged to be engaged, that’s not engaged – to me that just indicates a want by some people to dramaticize this thing and add a new layer of rhetoric to the whole situation, to suggest he was her fiancée – they weren’t and that should be obvious) who she probably loves very much and is experiencing yet more emotional pain by being away from him. Now, if anything I say here has any truth to it all, and I am not at all certain that it does, it paints a very clear picture of why she would want to leave. But, why stay gone so long; why not reach out to her family?

Well, Mason (and for those of you who think I am Mason, you are sorely mistaken, which should be obvious to most of you who can analyze a few lines of text, which btw, if you couldn’t tell I’m from Colorado and he’s from Kentucky, and I don’t even know if changing the city from which you are posting is even possible, and besides he’s an old guy with more years of working experience than I have living experience, but I still really liked his work on this board, since what he did actually involved work) said in a earlier post that he thought maybe Maura had the family from hell. Well, I’m inclined to think the same thing. Sorry folks. And I’m betting, I’m really betting, that Fred knew even before the weekend leading up to her disappearance that something was wrong with Maura. He knew she was depressed, maybe even knew that she was drinking too much (oh, lord, I can tell I’m gonna get burned) but just speculating, and that he really wanted to help her out. Ok, so he decides to help her buy a car. They go shopping, they find one, a Prizm (and much like the fiancée deal, I think they idea of the Corolla really being hers is just another rhetorical ploy to bring another level of dramatics to the story), and they decide between the two of them that they will trade in the Saturn the next weekend and pick up the Prizm. So, here’s Fred, doing all these wonderful favors, and while he’s at it, he let’s her borrow his brand new Corolla. Deep down, he may even still be upset with her for not being able to, let’s say,“get with the program” and “find something to settle into”. Seriously, when it comes to a parent wanting certain things for their children, many parents have been guilty of much worse. However, he feels he can help her out here, and that maybe she will find her way. Maybe she even expressed to him that she wasn’t interested in nursing school anymore, and desperately wanted out. If so, he may have not had a positive reaction. And maybe, Maura is much more sensitive to her father’s disapproval than we’ve ever considered on this board. So, then, she goes out drinking (which a witness has verified) and wrecks his brand new Corolla (which we know happened for a fact).

Part 3
Now, according to Fred, he was very understanding, and she was a nervous wreck, but he is the ONLY witness to their interaction after the accident. Isn’t it possible (I’m not saying it’s true), that he was a little less than forgiving? Now, if this is the case, then Maura already knows that she is a mess, now she is having to deal with the anger of her father, and she has to listen to him on the phone arguing with insurance people who say that the accident may not be covered, and he is probably up to his eyebrows with fury. Honestly, in the world we live in, I don’t think such a reaction would be unlikely for anyone. I wouldn’t expect my parents to be happy if I were to wreck their brand new car. I’d probably feel a lot of shame and a lot of guilt, especially in the case that I had a drinking problem (or at least had been drinking the night of) that led to the accident. Shame, guilt, maybe even a resentment of her father for one reason or another. Perhaps, feeling that she is a total wreck, he suggests to her that she should come “home” for awhile, and forget about school, and get her self straight. I don’t know. I don’t know. I don’t know. I do know that addressing these questions shouldn’t be off limits. And yes, given such a situation, I feel that she may very well have had every intention to run away. Where? To the mountains of NH, to West Point? Maybe she felt like she needed to get away from her family for good. Maybe they’ve traumatized her. Maybe she’s afraid of them? There was a posting earlier that said Fred, at the first press conference, said something along the lines of “come back and we’ll work this out”–WHAT DOES THAT MEAN? I don’t believe for a second that it was empty rhetoric coached by LE, news media, etc, as others have claimed. Everything I read here points to her having wanted to get away. If so, why is it so hard to believe that she did get away? Maybe she did and feels a lot better for it. Maybe I am just projecting. Maybe we won’t ever have the answers, but what good is searching for them if some of the obvious questions cannot even be asked? Well, I’m asking some here. Does anyone care to take it further… shall I go on?

"I am trying to make a personality judgment/attack here"

That sentence came out the wrong way, as it should read "I am NOT trying to make a personality judgment/attack here."

Maybe the articles below will give others a better understanding of why experts have stated the person(s) responsible for Maura's disapearance has done it before and will do it again.

http://www.geocities.com/compagna_psaradelis/...

http://framemaster.tripod.com/bigpicture.htm

http://www.sptimes.com/2008/01/27/Life/New_in...

hi Matermind.all of it sounds right on the money to me. thanks for having the integrity to post it. take care philip

Whiston on MMM.com there is a photo
of the SBD yard I think you should look at it!
I want to point that SBD exwife/girl's bus was parked in front the garage.
And if was parked back to the house
alone the tree line while a street light
shining on his yard I really don't believe he could have seen the accident from that spot.

WHISTON wrote:

hi Matermind.all of it sounds right on the money to me. thanks for having the integrity to post it. take care philip

Philip,

Maura being asked to leave West Point is new informatin and news to me. Informatin that has yet to be confirmed but yet and all people are theorizing it as fact.

Do you have proof.

Maura was in the top of her class in the Nursing Program at U-Mass per the Dean of Students.

I tried to scan this without luck.
Fri Feb 13, 2004 Caledonian Record.
Bethlehem, NH
Fred Murray has issued a plea to his 21 year old daughter t contact him so they
can work together on straightening out wha is troubling her.
"I don't know exactly what you think is the matter" Murray said, again pleading to his daughter "It isn't anything that can't be easily solved."
He said it is unusual for her to take off.
He had last seen her Sunday afternoon.
Murray did say Maura was upset about something that had happened over the weekend. He als said whatever it was wasn't a big deal.
Raush said he had spoken to Maura Sunday and as recently as Monday and "everything seemed fine"
When aske why Maura came here Murray stated "It's very familiar" he said.

"Does anyone care to take it further… shall I go on?"

I should say something here - well a few things. Of everything I know (and keeping in mind what others may know that is not public) several scenarios as to what happened come to mind.

I am also in favor of discussing the evidence and considering what might have happened.

Of some of the scenarios I have thought of - I've not posted them here - because, if I'm wrong, well, nothing good would come of it.

In my mind any scenario has a 1 in [less then ten, but more then five] chance. A few appear on the surface to have more weight because of the partially explainable defensiveness I've witnessed. In some of the scenarios I can't disprove only sympathy is appropriate.

But I'm only here to say what my opinion is - its not my place to demand you to censor yourself.

The idea that Maura had left to start a new life has been discussed and thought of - I just state it as possible - but have not stated publicly what her reasons might be.

In general - until verifiable - all I know is that it is possible, among other things, that an unknown pressure, event or tragedy could have caused her demise there. But I also see it just as possible that she left the Saturn after the accident and later on, when no one was around to witness what happened, anything could have happened - from all ends of the spectrum.

When I first arrived I felt that there was a concrete time line and that she was definitely in the Saturn. At that point - it was just a question as to if Mr. Atwood harmed her - or she walked up the road never to be seen again. I now don't think she was harmed by Mr. Atwood, I don't think he paid much attention to the driver and when he was asked questions by people eager to know what he saw - lied (if he did lie) to not be the seen as a bad person.[Answer to Weeper's question.]

Well - the more the time line is discussed the more convinced I am that something is wrong with it. Weeper - who has been kind enough to come on here and lead some discussions brought up the question as to if it was Maura in the car or a Man. A cousin of Maura's said that there was no liquor store video. So there are cracks - there are many possibilities - and I consider that now.

Ditto thanks for all your hard work!

WHISTON wrote:

hi Matermind.all of it sounds right on the money to me. thanks for having the integrity to post it. take care philip

Men may be inexact or even untruthful in ordinary matters and suffer as a consequence only the disesteem of their associates or the inconvenience of unfavorable litigation, but the inexact or untruthful soldier trifles with the lives of his fellow men and with the honor of his government, and it is therefore no matter of pride but rather a stern disciplinary necessity that makes West Point require of her students a character for trustworthiness that knows no evasions." Thus, the Honor System has its roots both in ethical considerations and in practical military necessity.
Honor, as it is understood by the Corps of Cadets, is a fundamental attribute of character. Honor is a virtue which implies loyalty and courage, truthfulness and self respect, justice and generosity. Its underlying principle is truth. It is not a complicated system of ethics, but merely "honest dealing and clean thinking." If a cadet is true in thought, word, and deed, there is no question about his meeting the standards of the Corps. On the other hand, quibbling, evasive statements, or the use of technicalities to conceal guilt are not tolerated at West Point.

Cadets who are found guilty of violations of the Honor Code are either allowed to resign or required to stand trial by court-martial. Cases of trial are comparatively rare, for most erring cadets prefer to leave the Academy quietly. Records of all alleged violations in which the evidence does not warrant trial are kept in a confidential file as long as the cadet remains at the Academy. When he leaves, this file is destroyed.

http://www.west-point.org/users/usma1983/4076...

Mastermind, my ideas run along the same lines as yours and pretty much always have--I though have neve taken the time to formulate the express the complete hypothesis. I have been blasted before about my ideas, and surely will be again, as will many others. The important thing though, is getting the thoughts, ideas and suppositions out there to possibly trigger someone's memory or forgotten occurrence that will help lead to the final explanation. I so wish someone would talk openly about the conversations that were had on the phone with her, talk about the voicemails she left for the last people she called....among other things.

Mason wrote:

V.
Recommendation regarding critically important and necessary forensic analysis.
1. Dust the bottle for fingerprints and swab the mouth for residual saliva and DNA testing.
2. Dust the area of the Saturn for a palm print where the SBD saw the driver place her hand when she leaned on it for support.
3. Dust the steering wheel of the Saturn for fingerprints.
4. Dust for prints the area of the lid on the trunk where the person who opened and shut the trunk would have touched it.
5. Dust the connectors on the cigarette lighter cell phone charger for thumb and index fingerprints.
6. Swab the airbag for dried saliva and DNA test the swab.
7. Dust the airbag for fingerprints because the driver would have grabbed it to get it out of her way to get out of the car.
8. Check the receipt from the liquor store for Maura’s thumb and forefinger fingerprint using the ninhydrin process.

who has possession of veh at this time. has it been kept from the elements. if out in rain outside prints are gone.

Mason wrote:

V.
Recommendation regarding critically important and necessary forensic analysis.
1. Dust the bottle for fingerprints and swab the mouth for residual saliva and DNA testing.
2. Dust the area of the Saturn for a palm print where the SBD saw the driver place her hand when she leaned on it for support.
3. Dust the steering wheel of the Saturn for fingerprints.
4. Dust for prints the area of the lid on the trunk where the person who opened and shut the trunk would have touched it.
5. Dust the connectors on the cigarette lighter cell phone charger for thumb and index fingerprints.
6. Swab the airbag for dried saliva and DNA test the swab.
7. Dust the airbag for fingerprints because the driver would have grabbed it to get it out of her way to get out of the car.
8. Check the receipt from the liquor store for Maura’s thumb and forefinger fingerprint using the ninhydrin process.

you assume these things have not been done, when in reality we do not know what pd has done. great suggestions though

elsewherebriefly wrote:

Philip,
Maura being asked to leave West Point is new informatin and news to me. Informatin that has yet to be confirmed but yet and all people are theorizing it as fact.
Do you have proof.
Maura was in the top of her class in the Nursing Program at U-Mass per the Dean of Students.

Well, I'm glad I'm not included among those who stated this as a fact, since I only added a suppostion based on an earlier speculation. I'm not really sure that anyone here can differentiate between fact and fiction in this case anyway. It seems the two have become intertwined to the degree that the language is nearly moribund.

Lady Gray wrote:

<quoted text>
Bill, Bill, Bill........PUH LEEZE. Your last comment above is an insult to the intelligence of law enforcement. They LOVE to get DUI's. They live for it. It is part of their job.
And they would never let someone who was incapacitated by alcohol/drugs go free just because they are attractive. That is severe liability on their part in the event something happened down the road after they released them. License plates are called in and recorded by dispatch and it could be traced back to them.
I am confident that Maura was not inebriated to the point of not being able to responsibly drive. To say otherwise insults that officer who handled that accident.

Definitely agree with the liability part,but in my opinion you insult le just as much by saying that the love or live for dui's. It a job and a professional does what he is suppose to that would have been enough said.

goat wrote:

<quoted text>who has possession of veh at this time. has it been kept from the elements. if out in rain outside prints are gone.

Not sure where the Saturn is now, but for quite a long time (couple years at least) it was in a field used as some type of lot by State Police Troop F in Twin Mountain, NH. That's where all or most of the pictures were taken that show the damage to the Saturn. I've looked and I can't see any evidence of fingerprint powder on any surfaces of the car, but maybe the car was wiped down when they were done.

pansie wrote:

<quoted text>
I am a woman who has been pulled over at least TWELVE TIMES before the age of thirty with never a ticket- various reasons, never DUI related, but still... girls get out of tickets easily.

Tickets,(which are at discretion of officer) and duis are very different especially when an accident(a written record) is involved. Contrary to posters here mass majority of le honest hard working people who do what they are suppose to do. So far on this post both le in nh (local and state) ard now ma for disappearance. grasping

There is so much more to know. I really hope that HPD, NHSP, FBI or whoever is currently investigating already know, and they are waiting for that last piece to fall into place before making some type of arrest, or at least pressuring someone to tell what they know.

goat wrote:

<quoted text>who has possession of veh at this time. has it been kept from the elements. if out in rain outside prints are gone.

Last I saw it (august 9th of this year), it was in the fenced yard outside of the barracks on 302--F Troop