Where is MAURA MURRAY

sniffin wrote:

I was there at one of the searches and the things that Kathleen was saying about her sister were not pleasant....more alarming than anything! Then her hubby came over and shut her up literally. As they walked away he was trying to be discreet while yelling at her. With their suspicious activity, one tends to wonder...
Looking for comments...

Weren't they very close? Didn't they chat almost daily?

I have always wondered about Vasi and the Saturn connection. You've gone over some real good points made a couple years back and added food for thought. Dang, and taking the car off campus really makes sense. Didn't the windshield crack on the inner glass though?
Sniffin, can you repeat what was said at the search without giving yourself away? All I can relate to about Kathleen and Tom 'bickering' is that they likely had to start off their marriage on a sad note that may or may not be consuming them. Kathleen and Maura were so close and my sister and I are too but she causes such heartache. For Kathleen to have to go from whatever was progressing to having no Maura at all must be totally "maddening"

BeagleBart wrote:

<quoted text>And it definitely would have set the airbags off.

It definitely would NOT set off the airbags. And Sgt Smiths report states that the airbags were deployed when he examined the car. Well before the tow truck got there.

J

I'm sneaking in a heartfelt thank you to all. I read/absorb/feel everything, just afraid to repy sometimes.

Just Me, I feel your words..I think of the hours and miles that Silky, Mcsmom and..(can't remember who else) spent up 91...distributing fliers.
at rest areas, up to PnH.in 2004 through at least 2005, perhaps longer. Perhaps Maura was taken in VT?..Wells River Citgo/Store...PnH
and car driven over to NH....? I recall the Posts about people knowing the jurusdictions and back roads. Whiston, wish your question
re: camera at ATM had been asked/answered back then. I find it unbelievable that she left her clothers, school books, a book with her brothers photograph, toiletries, jewely etc. I will never believe Maura chose willingly to leave Joseph. behind.

hi beagle.what if Maura damaged mrMurrays car on purpose to get him out of amherst or to prevent the saturn being taken for a trade in because it was damaged and she did not want him to see it.i want to see proof of the car being in amherst undamaged that weekend was it being stored out of site or was it already out of amherst.also the reports about Petrit Vasi suggest he may have been dumped there after being hit somewhere else or i think car surfing. i could be wrong about the last thing.the only thing that ties the car to amherst monday fen 09 04 is a liquor store receipt found in the car.take care whiston

hi all,did anyone on this site see who took the gloves from the saturn to give to the dog. i read somewhere way back that someone was seen taking things from the trunk and putting them in the car after the car was stuck in the snow.they were maybe digging out the jack to try and move the car so they were in no hurry to leave or they were making room in the trunk.why was Mauras student sticker left on the car.what other stickers would be on a car from M.A.If there was a search why was the car not secured .this has always seemed odd to me.someone asked on the old forum a very good question why did Maura leave so late in the day.as for the car being in rough shape we only have the old forum reporting that.what time did Maura ,if she did , pick up her mail on Monday.i spoke with a umass detective testerday about the reported 'gag' order on the Maura Murray case .they said that the case belonged to NHSP since right after she vanished and there is no gag order in place .it was implied that there never was,but what a great way to stop people asking about Mauras life in amherst.jeremy i would like to talk to you no big deal .just want to pick your brain as you were at amherst at the same time as Maura.Anna you posted twice on the old forum.you were also at amherst .i would like to know about the day to day stuff .take care philip

sniffin wrote:

I was there at one of the searches and the things that Kathleen was saying about her sister were not pleasant....more alarming than anything! Then her hubby came over and shut her up literally. As they walked away he was trying to be discreet while yelling at her. With their suspicious activity, one tends to wonder...
Looking for comments...

Five Stages Of Grief

Denial and Isolation.
At first, we tend to deny the loss has taken place, and may withdraw from our usual social contacts. This stage may last a few moments, or longer.

Anger.
The grieving person may then be furious at the person who inflicted the hurt (even if she's dead), or at the world, for letting it happen. He may be angry with himself for letting the event take place, even if, realistically, nothing could have stopped it.

Bargaining.
Now the grieving person may make bargains with God, asking, "If I do this, will you take away the loss?"

Depression.
The person feels numb, although anger and sadness may remain underneath.

Acceptance.
This is when the anger, sadness and mourning have tapered off. The person simply accepts the reality of the loss.

"The orginal witness statement to police was
The officer began questioning neighbors looking for
information about the accident. They learned that a woman
in her 20s had been seen at the vehicle.
They questioned a school bus driver who had stopped to
inquire is she needed
assistance. According to the statement given the police,
the witness stated the woman's speech was slurred and she
had to hold on to something while she stood. "She begged me
not to call police," according to the witness' statement.

She did not hit a snowbank she hit a set of 3 trees hard enough for 2 witnesses to hear it
and to set off both air bags which have been tested along with the soda bottle.

Believe what you want the FACTS are what they are.
Despite people being bullied into changing and twisting them to fit on or another theory.

Jefferson wrote:

<quoted text>
It definitely would NOT set off the airbags. And Sgt Smiths report states that the airbags were deployed when he examined the car. Well before the tow truck got there.
J

That's correct and it's an important point. But the truck that hauled the Saturn from the Rt. 112 crash scene is not the one referred to in the earlier post. It's possible that a tow truck or another vehicle or even some kind of heavy object set off the airbags before the Saturn was discovered.

In other words, the Saturn may have first sustained a much smaller dent from having hit Vasi. Later, the Vasi dent may have been obscured, deliberately or not, by a second collision in the same spot, which set off the airbags.

But it's true, and important to remember, that the airbags were already deployed when the Saturn was first discovered.

Two related questions: Would both airbags deploy in a '96 Saturn if the seats were occupied by a weight less than X number of pounds? Is 60 pounds the standard?

Chief Williams noted that photographic evidence and documentation at the scene of an accident are standard
operating procedure.
Photographs of tire tracks in the snow and into a set of
three trees on the side of the road are evidence that Maura
Murray did indeed strike the set of trees with enough
impact to deploy both airbags. Photographs taken the
night of the accident indeed show that the same damage
occurred that night match the damage that exists today.
Sgt. Smith then impounded the vehicle.

There photographs of the car before being towed with both air bags deployed!

BeagleBart wrote:

<quoted text>
That's correct and it's an important point. But the truck that hauled the Saturn from the Rt. 112 crash scene is not the one referred to in the earlier post. It's possible that a tow truck or another vehicle or even some kind of heavy object set off the airbags before the Saturn was discovered.
In other words, the Saturn may have first sustained a much smaller dent from having hit Vasi. Later, the Vasi dent may have been obscured, deliberately or not, by a second collision in the same spot, which set off the airbags.
But it's true, and important to remember, that the airbags were already deployed when the Saturn was first discovered.
Two related questions: Would both airbags deploy in a '96 Saturn if the seats were occupied by a weight less than X number of pounds? Is 60 pounds the standard?

White Wash wrote:

She did not hit a snowbank she hit a set of 3 trees hard enough for 2 witnesses to hear it
and to set off both air bags...

This is excellent information. Is it possible to identify the location of the hit trees in relation to the Saturn? Was the Saturn discovered fully in the road? Parallel to the direction of the lanes? Or partly off the road?
In the eastbound lane heading west or in the westbound lane heading east?

Philip, keep pecking away. Here's another note kept worth sharing.
CW IS A SELF-EMPLOYED CONTRACTOR WHO DOES CARPENTRY WORK, DRY WALLING, AND IS A SORT OF "JACK-OF-ALL-TRADES" GUY. HE DID IN FACT BUILD THE HOUSE HE LIVES IN....WHICH ACTUALLY FACES BRADLEY HILL ROAD...ODD SORT OF DESIGN AS THERE IS NO FRONT DOOR ON THIS DWELLING.
BACK IN FEB. 04' HE WAS THE ONLY ONE WHO REFUSED TO ALLOW HIS PROPERTY TO BE SEARCHED....AND TO MY KNOWLEDEG...IT NEVER WAS TO DATE.

Did anyone other than Maura or Fred see the Saturn between Thursday and Monday?

Was the Saturn parked on campus over that time period? If (if) the car was borrowed or damaged, did Maura have any place or off-campus friends with a driveway to park the car so any damage might be hidden?

With car issues and the need to start car-hunting, had Maura made friends or acquaintances with a mechanic or someone else involved with cars?

Upsetting, but is it possible that the car accidents (possibly 1 to even 4 --- maybe one in amherst, fred's new car for sure, maybe one or 2 in NH?) during a 5-day period might have been half-hearted attempts of a very upset person to hurt herself? I'm gonna get slammed for saying this. i'm not blaming the victim. it might just be the way a really stressed and depressed person could behave but sort of back off at the last moment and pull her punches because she was ambivalent about hurting herself? We have to consider her emotional meltdown on Thursday night as being a real big deal. Something major was going on. Beyond regular stress, beyond acting to get out of work IMO.

ANOTHER OLD NOTE

I do believe that the Saturn was deliberatley backed into the snowbank where it was found....for very spicific reasons, you bet I do! I do not believe the SBD took Maura, he's a big Oaph..and a lier, that may or may nt know something sinister happened.....I also believe the CW is involved with her disappearence whether before/during/after the fact I have yet determined....there are also other players we are looking into and will continue to do so until we find more answers

White Wash wrote:

Chief Williams noted that photographic evidence and documentation at the scene of an accident are standard
operating procedure.
Photographs of tire tracks in the snow and into a set of
three trees on the side of the road are evidence that Maura
Murray did indeed strike the set of trees with enough
impact to deploy both airbags. Photographs taken the
night of the accident indeed show that the same damage
occurred that night match the damage that exists today.
Sgt. Smith then impounded the vehicle.
There photographs of the car before being towed with both air bags deployed!
<quoted text>

That's really excellent information. It certainly makes sense that scene would have been well documented, including photographs. So, having hit the three trees looks like the cause of damage to the Saturn and may well account for the deployment of both airbags?

What about the seat weight required for the passenger side airbag to go off? Was this technology available in a '96 Saturn?

If a search warrant was requested for a possible crime scene, would drunk driving have been the reason? The only reason? Seems at least possible when no driver is immediately available.

Is all the secrecy surrounding this case typical of police procedure? Is a possible - and only possible - case of drunk driving, in which the driver disappears, normally investigated by the Major Crimes Unit of the NHSP? Would police seize Maura's computer and the items taken from the car by her family if this were only the case of a drunk driver going off the road and disappearing of her own accord?

Reminder, one neighbors sees the car back up paralell to the road, while another hears it crash. The nicks on the trees were too high up for the damage to the car and it wound up in the snow below so who's to say for sure it hit the scrawny trees? I think the damage happened before the trees, etc also and I'm glad you're talking to UMASS Philip.

Just me wrote:

BACK IN FEB. 04' HE WAS THE ONLY ONE WHO REFUSED TO ALLOW HIS PROPERTY TO BE SEARCHED....AND TO MY KNOWLEDEG...IT NEVER WAS TO DATE.

Given the controversy and publicity of this case, frankly, he may have had a very good reason to not allow a police search of his property - a perfectly legitimate reason. No attorney would ever have advised him to open his house for a warrantless search by police.

You can see the actual accident report again
from www.hansonexpress.com
For actual facts.
But the Maricotts statement is they could
see tail lights so it would be impossible for
it to be in a snow bank.
She hit the trees backed up and was attempting to
keep going when the school bus came I personally
believe since it was heading west.
Maricotts have stated there was damage to the tree.

BeagleBart wrote:

<quoted text>
This is excellent information. Is it possible to identify the location of the hit trees in relation to the Saturn? Was the Saturn discovered fully in the road? Parallel to the direction of the lanes? Or partly off the road?
In the eastbound lane heading west or in the westbound lane heading east?

On MMM it was stated that Maura had broken down
and the car was towed back to campus where it
sat as she was afraid to drive it!
Fred had also followed her back from CT one time
because she was having issues!

quija wrote:

Did anyone other than Maura or Fred see the Saturn between Thursday and Monday?
Was the Saturn parked on campus over that time period? If (if) the car was borrowed or damaged, did Maura have any place or off-campus friends with a driveway to park the car so any damage might be hidden?
With car issues and the need to start car-hunting, had Maura made friends or acquaintances with a mechanic or someone else involved with cars?
Upsetting, but is it possible that the car accidents (possibly 1 to even 4 --- maybe one in amherst, fred's new car for sure, maybe one or 2 in NH?) during a 5-day period might have been half-hearted attempts of a very upset person to hurt herself? I'm gonna get slammed for saying this. i'm not blaming the victim. it might just be the way a really stressed and depressed person could behave but sort of back off at the last moment and pull her punches because she was ambivalent about hurting herself? We have to consider her emotional meltdown on Thursday night as being a real big deal. Something major was going on. Beyond regular stress, beyond acting to get out of work IMO.