Where is MAURA MURRAY

Johnny Bravado wrote:

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HAHAHA I love listening to nerds - this one in particular has spent his entire life wishing he could be one of the guys actually dates beautiful, sophisticated women, and when he hears about someone doing it, he naturally becomes envious and jealous. I don't just think - I am absolutely 100% certain that "propaganda firetruck" has never once had a good-looking, respectable girlfriend, and he never will. He knows it and I know it.
"propaganda firetruck" has proven beyond any doubt that he has absolutely no self-respect, no self-esteem, and no integrity. He knows very well that he's just copying and pasting my own remarks back to me, and he doesn't care the least bit about how utterly pathetic that is. It doesn't bother him at all; he's been pathetic his whole life. He can't even come up with anything even remotely original; his brain cannot think on such a level. He's been so affected by what I've said to him in the past, that he is now trying to use what I've said towards others to make himself feel better. This is indubitably one of the most pitifully repulsive men I've ever encountered, and I've lived and been everywhere. He knows I'm right too. His life must truly suck. Hey "propaganda firetruck", how does it feel to know that you jerk off to women that aren't even good enough to date me? You couldn't even look at the last five women I've dated, let alone get with them. Women are perceptive; they can see right through little nerds like you. They know how pathetically disgusting you are, just as I do.
You'll never be on my level; you'll just keep on wishing you were. You'll never be able to think on my level; you'll just keep copying and pasting my words to try to and appear intelligible. I wouldn't expect anything less from such a naturally pitiful sow.
If you're going to come to Sarasota, come to the club "Cheetah" on 301 - it's my club. My bouncers probably won't let you in, and even if they do, the women there will just use a little sucker like you and rob you clean.

Just what purpose do you have in posting this???

I'm reading along, thinking how nice to see exchanges of posts that could have some merit and this post pops us.

What's the matter? Don't like the fact that there is an intelligent maybe purposeful discussion going on? Trying to throw things off track?

Everyone - scroll on by (SOB)........Ignore.

propaganda firetruck wrote:

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You nerd. Why would she put a rag in her tailpipe once the car was already stopped running if her intention was to stop any smoke from coming out? What would be the point of that? I guess you are trying to say that she was psychologically disturbed. If she was drunk and wanted to avoid attention AFTER her car stopped running, why on god's green earth would she put a rag in her tailpipe to stop the smoke. You need to read and think more clearly before insulting others. You're a fucking retard.

HAHAHAHA HOLY SHIT!!! I cannot believe a human being could actually be so genuinely stupid. He is so completely oblivious to the fact that he is incredibly fucking dumb, and as a result, he keeps on making such laughably dumb statements. I don't think I've ever came across someone so pathetically stupid - seriously. I asked you to READ IT SLOWLY and TRY YOUR HARDEST TO COMPREHEND IT propaganda firetruck, and you couldn't even come close to accomplishing such an easy task. This typifies your vast stupidity and your ostensible very-limited intellect.

You ask, "why on God's green earth would she put a rag in her tail pipe to stop the smoke?" HAHAHAH WOW I'm in shock. I didn't think human beings were this dumb. A 5-year-old could honestly answer this. How utterly stupid can you be? Seriously? You answered your own question and you didn't even realize it. The combination of words and sentences that you just put together is not just a microcosm of how blatantly low your level of intelligence is, but also exemplifies your obliviousness to your own stupidity. I've met a lot of stupid people in my life, and I've encountered plenty of stupid people on the Internet, but I don't ever think I've came across someone who is so oblivious to their stupidity that they continue to embarrass themselves beyond all imagination on a consistent basis.

Let me break down your stupidity, and your obliviousness to your own stupidity:

Firstly, FRED MURRAY, Maura's father, was the one to say that she probably put a rag in the tail pipe to stop the smoke lest someone see it and the cops came.

If she just got into an accident and DIDN'T WANT THE COPS CALLED, as she told the SBD, and her tail pipe was smoking, then OBVIOUSLY she would want to do something to stop it so that it doesn't attract attention and nobody in the area sees it and calls the cops. DO YOU COMPREHEND THAT PROPAGANDA FIRETRUCK? Probably not. TRY REAL HARD THOUGH BUDDY - READ IT REAL REAL SLOW. Then read it over and over and over again. Perhaps maybe you'll eventually be able to comprehend and absorb such a simple statement, but history has proven that you're just incapable of doing it.

The most hysterical part about "propaganda firetruck"s stupidity is that he is so stupid to the extent where he actually believed himeslf. How stupid can you be to the point where you can't even deduce how someone would attempt to prevent a smoking tail pipe? It's unbelievable to me.

Additionally, you made about 6 different incoherent, unintelligible responses to my one post over the course of several hours, which once again indubitably indicates how sad of a human being you are. You intentionally lie more than anyone else just to try to make yourself feel better, and in the process, you embarrass yourself by exhibiting your unprecedented stupidity publicly. This post, just like dozens of other posts you've made, typifies not only how dumb you are but how oblivious you are to it.

You do realize that stupid people don't know they're stupid, right? Part of being stupid is that you don't know that you're stupid. Have you ever seen anybody say, "I'm stupid."? No. Stupid people are oblivious to the fact that they're stupid. It's not like they look in the mirror and say, "Hey! I'm stupid!" They don't know about it - only everyone else does. With each and every post you make, your stupidity takes on a new level.

mcsmom wrote:

firecat...you can stroke WW ego to pump her for info on your own time.....leave me out of it.

Wait, what?

Lady Gray wrote:

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Just what purpose do you have in posting this???
I'm reading along, thinking how nice to see exchanges of posts that could have some merit and this post pops us.
What's the matter? Don't like the fact that there is an intelligent maybe purposeful discussion going on? Trying to throw things off track?
Everyone - scroll on by (SOB)........Ignore.

Lady Gray,

Firstly, I've physically done more for this case and trying to find Maura than probably 90% of the people in this forum. I care as much about trying to help this case and bring some justice to the Murray family as anyone.

However, "propaganda firetruck", unquestionably one of the most pitifully dumb men I've ever witnessed, has went out of his way on dozens of occasions to try so hard to sound intelligible by making incoherent and illogical statements to try to make himself seem a little brighter. You obviously don't know the extent of how pathetic he is. You obviously don't know me and/or what I've done for this case. Suggesting that I'm throwing things off is a joke to me. And for the record, never in the history of this forum has "propaganda firetruck" ever contributed anything remotely "purposeful" to this discussion. All he's ever contributed are assumptions, lies, and insults when people point out his assumptions and lies.

Go through the pages - just a few days ago, he made up off the top of his head that "Maura claims she was in fear for her life" before she took the drive. Several people asked him where he got this, and they kept asking him, and he kept lying, and then he said he heard it on some other post, and then he couldn't provide that post, and then he thinks that people are stupid and that nobody can read him. Stupid people don't realize that smart people can read them like childrens books; and he's a perfect example.

Feel free to ignore my posts if you'd like, but don't ever suggest I'm trying to disrupt some sort of purposeful discussion. "propaganda firetruck" is not intellectually capable of ever making a purposeful remark on any level.

Mason wrote:

While I'm at it, I'll point out that the JO article recounting what Sgt Smith did to investigate this case seems quite professional to me and his efforts to contact Fred Murray, who was the registered owner of the Saturn with a home address in Weymouth, MA, appear to be responsible and persistent. I believe he expended more effort to contact Fred Murray than most police officers would have in similar circumstances.
Fred Murray accused the Haverhill Police Department of not expending sufficient effort in timely fashion to search for Maura and contact him, but that does not appear to be the case, assuming the information in the article is correct. Sgt Smith attempted to contact the registered owner of the Saturn and the only information he had was that the owner was someone named Fred Murray with an address in Weymouth, MA. Unfortunately, Mr. Murray was living in Bridgeport, CT, and it took awhile to track him down.
I believe Mr. Murray's accusatory and confrontational response was grossly inappropriate under the circumstances because if anyone was to blame for the delay in contacting him, Mr. Murray only needed to look in a mirror to identify that person.
Based on the scent trail followed by the dog, we have reason to believe that Maura caught a ride from the scene before Sgt Smith arrived. Therefore, what could he possibly have done that would have made any difference finding Maura?
This is why I do not understand Mr. Murray's attitude. Yes, he was upset, as any parent would be under the circumstances, but why did he not only launch an attack against HPD, but continue blaming them for Maura's disappearance. At some point, one would think he would pause and reflect on his inappropriate conduct and seek to heal his relationship with LE, but that hasn't happened and I doubt that it ever will.
As a former criminal defense attorney who made a living exposing and attacking police negligence and misconduct, I doubt anyone would consider me to be biased in favor of law enforcement. Nevertheless, I think Sgt Smith and HPD did an exemplary job and to the extent that they might have searched more quickly and thoroughly, I don't believe it would have made any difference.
Unfortunately, the die is cast. HPD and the NHSP obviously detest Mr. Murray and will make no effort to communicate with him. I am not surprised because it looks like he asked for it. If the NHSP is professional, and I do not know if it is, it will not allow a strong prejudice against Mr. Murray to affect the investigation. We will never know if it did.
Fred

What we have here is a simple case of Person A's word against Person B's word. Fred maintains to this day that he received one message. Obviously we don't have outgoing police calls to verify one side or the other, but even in the log of incoming calls, you can see that Fred tried more than once to get hold of CS to try to return the call.

Reading the JO article as the basis of your opinion, yes, it does seem that Fred "was asking for it" but bear in mind the sources for the article, as opposed to the sources for other articles written. They vary greatly.

Curious..

Vermont Locals:
Does the local paper there post all the stuff that happens in town. car prowls, BOL's etc.. The print everything. you know how small towns are...
What about there?

you can see what i am talking about www.wenworld.com - click on local then news of the record.. don't get a speeding ticket everyone in town will know.

ANY UPDATE ON THE BOL ?

Advocator wrote:

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With all due respect ... why are you resurrecting a (now) OLD post and interrupting the current discussion with this? I'm sure no one here cares about this personal stuff. There is not one word in your post having to do with Maura Murray.
One thing you COULD fill us in on is: have you had any luck arranging to talk with the SBD??

You're right. I shouldn't be interrupting the current discussion, and my apologies to those of you that I irritated who genuinely are trying to help this case. I personally feel the need to analyze stupidity though; I don't think stupid people should be allowed to participate in anything that smarter people are involved with. Again though, ignore my posts; they're aimed directly at propaganda firetruck's stupidity.

In regard to the SBD: I've came up with 6 questions, along with introductory statements that I'm going to make lest he does not want to answer any questions. I know I only have one shot, so at the beginning I want to take the best shot possible to try and convince him to just answer a few questions, and I've went about the wording in a number of ways.

A few people have submitted some good questions to me, and I suggest that anyone else who thinks they have a good question to ask him PM me on the other forum. I can make the attempt to interview or ask him questions basically whenever, however, I only have one shot, and I want to make sure I do everything perfect. If anyone has anything else they'd like to let me know, please PM me at "JohnnyBravado" on the other forum. Thank you.

http://www.whitmanhansonexpress.com/index.php...
Sorry if this has been posted recently.

Johnny Bravado wrote:

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Lady Gray,
Firstly, I've physically done more for this case and trying to find Maura than probably 90% of the people in this forum. I care as much about trying to help this case and bring some justice to the Murray family as anyone.

Sez you.

Johnny Bravado wrote:

However, "propaganda firetruck", unquestionably one of the most pitifully dumb men I've ever witnessed, has went out of his way on dozens of occasions to try so hard to sound intelligible by making incoherent and illogical statements to try to make himself seem a little brighter.

His IQ (or yours for that matter) is not the subject of this discussion. Going off on tangents about him IS disruptive to this discussion.

Johnny Bravado wrote:

You obviously don't know the extent of how pathetic he is.

But obviously we AREN'T INTERESTED.

Johnny Bravado wrote:

You obviously don't know me and/or what I've done for this case. Suggesting that I'm throwing things off is a joke to me.

No, we don't know what you've done for this case, other than come on here and make long insulting posts about propaganda firetruck that have nothing to do with the discussion.

How do rantings between the two of you help to find Maura?

Lady Gray has obviously done alot for this case. From what I understand that including updating a family supported website - if the family didn't want negative stuff on the board - they could delete them. If it was my family I would too.

I have never met her PM'd her etc. From what I have read she has been helpful.

Play nice.

Johnny Bravado

Food for thought. If you are going to meet with him. I suggest you don't post your questions - since that would give him time to come up with an answer - and have time to think about it. I think he is pretty fed up with the entire case. So I wish you luck on your adventure.

Part 1

Mason wrote:

The possible explanations are ... May I have the envelope, please?
1. The phone did not make the trip north, and if Maura did, she did not take it with her.
2. Maura did not make the trip north.
3. Maura did make the trip north and took the cell phone with her, but she had it turned off and did not recharge it during the drive, perhaps because she forgot to recharge it or the cigarette lighter did not work and she could not use the portable recharger.
4. Maura took the phone with her when she left the wrecked Saturn believing it was fully charged (or grabbed her backpack not realizing the uncharged phone was in it), but it wasn't recharged and she could not recharge it because she left both chargers in the car. She subsequently decided to start a new life and not return to recover the Saturn, which she believed was totalled, and she discarded the phone because she didn't believe it was fair for Sharon to be stuck with the bill and she did not want Sharon to know where she was.
5. Maura was murdered or committed suicide somewhere within the area where there is no cell phone coverage. For obvious reasons I hate to call it a dead zone, but if this is what happened, I believe it's vitally important to define the boundaries of the dead zone, since her remains and/or her backpack likely are located within those boundaries.

I regret that I am inclined to doubt that Maura is alive, by the practical reality of 5 years having passed...this being nothing better than my personal opinion.
However, I don't exclude for one second the possibilities of her having been abducted/held captive (and even alive today), her voluntary/intended leaving, or, more doubtful, even a failed suicide attempt.

Part 2

On your points, Mason, here goes...

1) Unlikely/impractical for an otherwise intelligent/competent young woman (even if drinking) to travel without a cell phone.

2) Strongly agree...as the car was mechanically unsound; her identity (hair up Maura/hair down Maura) remains not positively confirmed at the Saturn's final location.

3)Agree. Can't tell you HOW MANY TIMES (don't ask me why) my kids have embarked on trips with cell phones minimally charged...so they've turned them off to preserve battery power for use, as needed.
Wonder if the Saturn's cigarette lighter was/can be checked to know if it and the portable recharger are both functional.

4)Took the phone, believing it was fully/adequately/minimally charged...but with the intention of returning to the car, and therefore, leaving behind the chargers...IMHO.
Also, it would be natural and necessary to seek assistance (a ride, a service tow, lodging...shelter)given the condition of the car unless Maura was disoriented/or otherwise impaired or intentionally escaping (every facet of these possibilities has been discussed).
Therefore, she either a) walked away (on the roadway or into the woods), b) approached the home of residents/entered or not, c) accepted a ride, or d) was taken away against her will in the course of engaging in any of these options.
Forgive me if I am restating the obvious...or if
there are holes in my logic.
I can't recall, but somehow doubt that in 2004 there was a strong awareness by the general public, and college students in particular, to regard cell phones as tracking devices.
And if she wanted to start a new life...why not carry along the items packed in the car (except liquor - impractical)...at least those that could be carried? A stuffed animal is light and easily stashed.

5) Absolutely.

Qualifiers, given I know much less than some, and perhaps, as much as others, I like to simplify; I am relatively impartial in this matter; I believe in the goodness of people and neighbors helping neighbors (to include strangers); and I have few, if any, concerns about the possibility of random violence...living my life fully while believing such encounters, if they occur, are unavoidable.
No need to reply...just a position statement spawned from yours, I suppose.

A long time ago I did some research on which artists were exhibiting at the gallery on campus, near Maura's dorm (forgot gallery name) during the fall and winter of 2003-2004. Who knows if this was the gallery she worked at. I think I found one artist from Burlington, VT. I posted all the artists on the old MMM forum (and, of course, no-one ever commented, haha!), but there seemed to something about most that made them unlikely to be a "special friend". For ex., one from Burlington might've been female, and another one, a male, I think was much older. I can go back and check some more. I WONDER IF THIS PERSON WAS A PHOTOGRAPHER? That rings a bell from the last time I looked.

Dawn wrote:

Curious..
Vermont Locals:
Does the local paper there post all the stuff that happens in town. car prowls, BOL's etc.. The print everything. you know how small towns are...
What about there?
you can see what i am talking about www.wenworld.com - click on local then news of the record.. don't get a speeding ticket everyone in town will know.
ANY UPDATE ON THE BOL ?

I found this and time line coincides with when DC announced a man went missing, but not sure if it the same person.

http://video.aol.com/video-detail/abq-man-mis...

Maybe Maura was an artist ? It was her art or a friend from high school. I think that could be likely. I have a painting from a friend - its in a spare bedroom but it is beautiful

Another man that went missing recently

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/29239785/

Thanks Sara - interesting...........

Sara
Actually that is an old news clip. Nicholas Garza's body was found May 8th 2008 in a creek in VT. That is not the BOL that was mentioned by DC. Unfortunately - Nicolas Garza's body was recovered

http://www.boston.com/news/local/vermont/arti...

Sorry Dawn, I thought that I had checked the date. My apologies for that.