Where is MAURA MURRAY

WTF-the-original wrote:

And this has nothing to do with being a "moron". It is a LAW of the universe that anything mechanical or electrical will fail at the worst possible time. One of Murphys' laws. Just like you can count on gravity.
Bill

OH HECK YEAH!!

Suzanne wrote:

<quoted text>
I agree. Shack has since 2004 been using various MM forums as a platform for venting her rage against the NH locals and the NH LE. Just recently she spent some time with some people in Littleton who said they were unfamiliar with the MM story which immediately prompted Shack to go into her 'hear no evil, speak no evil, see no evil' rant. OK, Shack we get it, the locals have at one time offended you, now please settle scores with them elsewhere not here.

As you re-read the above post, Dawn, please know the information is drawn from the perspective of someone with a longer history mine in this matter.

My impressions match Suzanne's confirmation that, most likely, Maura's disappearance fueled Shack's pre-existing issues with NH LE.

Suzanne's quote:

"Shack has since 2004 been using various MM forums as a platform for venting her rage against the NH locals and the NH LE."

Now, I will add to this...the probable (and later) connection that came about via Liko Kenney's shooting on 5/11/07.

The activist group supporting the Liko Kenney matter merged with Shack & Co./Liko Kenney in their shared view of NH LE and authorities.

Together, they could rage about the injustices perpetrated by NH LE.

They see Fred/Maura as victims of LE (without even knowing what happened to Maura, or if she even disappeared from NH!)
and
Liko Kenney as a victim of LE (even though he shot and mortally wounded a police officer).

The agenda is hidden...not obvious at first glance.
Although everyone is entitled to express their own views and their own "truths", an agenda colors a more balanced view and complicates finding solutions to problems.

Just my opinion, of course.

WTF-the-original wrote:

<quoted text>
OK, lets see if I can help here. All you ladies in particular. Buy a charger specifically to be kept in the car. Keep it in your car at all times. That way, when you need it most even if you need to talk with it attached to the charger you can at least use the phone. Even if you eventually need to leave the car, you can charge the phone first. There is no excuse for not buying a cell phone charger and keeping it in your car. None. I made sure my wife and boys have one and no one should drive around without one in the car at all times if they own a cell phone because guaranteed dollars to donuts when you need that phone the most it will be out of battery power.
Bill

Sadly, it's the 12v outlet in my car that needs the repair/replacement and not the charger. It's on my list after "change the oil" and "replace the front tires which might as well be made out of wood".

WTF-the-original wrote:

<quoted text>
OK, lets see if I can help here. All you ladies in particular. Buy a charger specifically to be kept in the car. Keep it in your car at all times. That way, when you need it most even if you need to talk with it attached to the charger you can at least use the phone. Even if you eventually need to leave the car, you can charge the phone first. There is no excuse for not buying a cell phone charger and keeping it in your car. None. I made sure my wife and boys have one and no one should drive around without one in the car at all times if they own a cell phone because guaranteed dollars to donuts when you need that phone the most it will be out of battery power.
Bill

There's much more to tell...to live it is believe it in my house...all off-topic, of course.
I am not an offender of multi-car/multi-phones and multi-plug violations.

I'll just add that life must be pretty ducky if everyone follows some house rules!...cuz they borrow my 'stuff' and don't put it back.

I even got my own 'tools'...they laughed when I locked them in a red thingy. Those, too, are ...'borrowed'.
Whose side are you on, WTF?

Thanks Snowy - now I get it. As an outsider - I can see even newbies having concerns over LE. I don't have a pre-exisiting issue. However, I think a parent shouldn't have to sue the AG and State to get information to search for his daughter. Brianna is listed on the FBI website. The local LE with holding so much info - does tend to make a newbie have the words "cover up" come to mind quite quickly. That was my first thought and I still think that is true today. Just my opinion.

Oh no.. firecat - it must be painfull for you to read my posts being an english prof. sorry.

Snowy White wrote:

<quoted text>
There's much more to tell...to live it is believe it in my house...all off-topic, of course.
I am not an offender of multi-car/multi-phones and multi-plug violations.
I'll just add that life must be pretty ducky if everyone follows some house rules!...cuz they borrow my 'stuff' and don't put it back.
I even got my own 'tools'...they laughed when I locked them in a red thingy. Those, too, are ...'borrowed'.
Whose side are you on, WTF?

Are you kidding? When my boys hit 18 I just assumed that all my old tools that I could no longer find were forfeit to them and I bought all new tools and put them in my new tool box with a lock that not even my wife knows the combination to.

Bill

FireCat wrote:

<quoted text>
Sadly, it's the 12v outlet in my car that needs the repair/replacement and not the charger. It's on my list after "change the oil" and "replace the front tires which might as well be made out of wood".

Energizer makes a small inexpensive battery device that can be kept for years as a backup charger for a cell phone.

I also have a device called a "Sidewinder" that is actually a small generator that is hand wound and recharges things like cell phones also.

Murphy is a real prick and I have multiple methods to try and combat him.

Bill

WTF-the-original wrote:

<quoted text>
Are you kidding? When my boys hit 18 I just assumed that all my old tools that I could no longer find were forfeit to them and I bought all new tools and put them in my new tool box with a lock that not even my wife knows the combination to.
Bill

That's the solution.
They all deserve each other...a trail of tools lie, rusted, here and there. Buy Sears. They replace. Or they used to.

Dawn, Initially the BOL was on WCAX channel 3 for 2 newscasts that I saw. There has been nothing that I have seen since.

Wowzer, I thanked White Wash for her contributions and know nothing about anyone saying not to like her.

FIT came about as a 'light' moment on the old forum. I guess people here don't want to lighten up! In the heavy duty days of these forums, sometimes laughing a little breaks the tension.

Snowy, I always respect your opinion and how clearly and calmly you state it. I do think that the 5/11 tragedy in Franconia galvanized many who feel poorly served by NH LE. Since I don't live in the area (and since I am not, in case I haven't mentioned it in the last ten seconds, related to ANYONE in Grafton County to my knowledge), I don't know that much about the truth of LE in that part of NH.

I do not believe that Shack is trying to convey a blanket condemnation of area residents. I believe that she is saying, as I have often done, that there is clearly a criminal element in the area - as evidenced by the murders of Chris Gray and Mr Powell - which is very dangerous and which is, for whatever reason, not being addressed by NH LE or, apparently, local residents. This criminal element - which I don't perceive as very different than you could find in any area with a similar degree of urban poverty (and I DO know about that)- is a danger to the local residents more than anyone else. I am still baffled as to why locals who must see this element are so enraged about it being mentioned.

Rather recently, and I'm not sure whether it was here or on another NH discussion, I raised the question about NH's several hundred autonomous SWAT teams. For a supposedly Libertarian state, I find that fact shocking and frightening - yet NH residents appear to be comfortable with it. One of the only responses I got was "well, they mostly do search & rescue."
Excuse me?
SWAT = Special Weapons and Tactics
Search and Rescue = self-explanatory
HARDLY the same thing.
VT SP, when asked about it, said that they have A (single) SWAT team of trained VSP officers.
This is precisely the sort of thing that makes some of us look at NH LE with a questioning eye. Throw in elements like the so-called "HPD 1" - a rusted, not professional-looking vehicle - and I can't help but wondering about the professionalism of some aspects of NH LE.

Scarzina's comments to the media, almost immediately after they started the belated search for Maura, were unprofessional, prejudicial, and uninformed. He has not, to my knowledege, ever backed down from those outrageous, unproven statements.

These are not merely the ravings of a few overwrought people seeing a problem where there is none.

Dawn wrote:

Turranna
I see what you are talking about.. Interseting alot in feb/march and even on the 9th, 19th.
Fred check it out

Yup.. Fred did take a look at it and responded last night. I'm just catching up on what I missed from last night. But a lot of them were either strangled or stabbed.. and a lot went missing in feb and march. Its an interesting coincidence. Also, as Fred has pointed out.. they all seem to be in little clusters. Near highways...

Beagle wrote:

<quoted text>A bunch of young people get pretty trashed, wake up later, one of them hasn't breathed in a few hours, what are they going to do? Move the whole freezer full of pot? Easier to just get the body out of the way.
I'm not sure how it would tie in with Haverhill, but maybe. Just a thought, that's all. Personally, I think there's a good 80 percent chance if she was murdered, it was done by one or more of only a half-dozen people. Should be pretty easy to figure out. Why LE refuses to do it? Maybe something local. Oh yes, local, dirty word. My bad.

Freezer of pot???????

sophie bean wrote:

Scarzina's comments to the media, almost immediately after they started the belated search for Maura, were unprofessional, prejudicial, and uninformed. He has not, to my knowledege, ever backed down from those outrageous, unproven statements.

Again, it is necessary to correct wrong information that is being handed out. There was no belated search, there was an immediate hasty search done of the area surrounding the car and the immediate avenues of departure which would be protocol in any department in the country and clearly appears to have been done correctly.

Things that were stated could very well still be true since we have no idea when or if Maura is missing because we have found nothing to indicate what happened to her or where it happened and if something did happen if it was by her own design or bad judgment.

I am really curious at what point does it no longer becomes NH LE’s fault and becomes Maura’s fault? I mean since so many are interested in assigning blame. If we find that she made it to Lincoln, is it still those officers fault that we don’t know where she is? What if she managed to get into the woods undetected to commit suicide or died accidentally, is that still their fault? At what point does any of this responsibility shift from everyone else to Maura?

You keep pitching them and I’ll keep hitting them.

Bill

WTF - Hi Bill ~
I think they could be a little more gracious about the records and forth coming with the family. However, I tend to lean towards not victimizing the victim - in this case is Maura/Murrays. Until there is a clue otherwise - she isa missing persons per LE. Could be Umass ?could be alot of things - until we know - I don't think we can victimize Maura. I DO think that LE was understaffed - and more could have been done. Unfortunately - most procedures LE have to follow are very minimal - take domestic violence for example. How many spouses do you hear about murdered after LE does a wellness check ? etc.. procedure is not always the best due diligence. I believe that to be true in this case. In that short amount of time - car or on foot - she could not have been far. If it wasn't her - they could not have been far either.

just my opinion..........

FireCat wrote:

<quoted text>
Were I so inclined, I could list some of the dozens of places I've been published--all nationally known literary sources--or some of the awards I've won. But I'm not sending you a resume....as I've learned from Mason...because then (a) I might be accused of not being me (not that Dawn cares who I am probably!), or (b) I'd be accused of being egotistical.
The reason I felt compelled to point it out, Suzanne, is because you stated in the first sentence, in the first clause, that they were FACTS. Now you are saying that they are opinions, which you said by the end of the post. That is why I asked WHICH WAS FACT AND WHICH WAS OPINION. A statement is either fact or opinion. It is data or the judgment of such data. It cannot be both simultaneously. Yet you state at the beginning of your post that something is FACT when by the end of the post it clearly is not. And you want us to believe it is FACT.
To quote you, back at yourself, perhaps less than eloquently but nevertheless very succinctly, "Duh."

Opinion = My use of the word garbage. Fact = All discussion of Amherst was discouraged. There was strong unanimous agreement that 1. SBD was bad 2.CW was bad 3.CE was bad 4. All NH LE was bad 5. FBI would be able to solve this case 6. FM was absolutely perfect in every way. I could go on and on. And please spare me your resume, I was only responding to your schoolmarmish criticism.

WTF-the-original wrote:

<quoted text>
Are you kidding? When my boys hit 18 I just assumed that all my old tools that I could no longer find were forfeit to them and I bought all new tools and put them in my new tool box with a lock that not even my wife knows the combination to.
Bill

Quick, someone send Bill's wife a hacksaw! LOL!
.

Suzanne wrote:

<quoted text>
Shack likes to speak in code because IT EXCLUDES THE NEWCOMERS and she yearns for the 'good old days' when the insiders spoke only to each other and rules were reverentially followed and everyone knew their place and stayed in it.

Suzanne are you serious? Shack is the easiest person to listen to on this forum. She is honest, sincere and totally forthright. If I disagree with some of her statements, she is one of few whom listens! She is biased in many ways, but isn't that what a public forum is about? I do not understand the consistant attack against her. For me personally Beagle drives me crazy, but I follow his posts and I check out what he has to say, because in the end, anyone involved with finding what happened to Maura bears at least civility. Sorry Beagle, I didn't start this comment with yuo in mind!

Dawn wrote:

... In that short amount of time - car or on foot - she could not have been far. If it wasn't her - they could not have been far either.:-)

Although ... if we accept that it was 7 minutes between the time the SBD last saw the girl at the car and the time CW arrived to find no girl at the car ... if Maura got a ride, in that 7 minutes she could have been about 3 miles away (if vehicle doing 25 mph), or 5 miles away (vehicle doing 35 mph), etc.

Suzanne wrote:

<quoted text>
Shack likes to speak in code because IT EXCLUDES THE NEWCOMERS and she yearns for the 'good old days' when the insiders spoke only to each other and rules were reverentially followed and everyone knew their place and stayed in it.

well stated, Suzanne. some of the behaviors have carried over. i'm glad i've never seen the exact quotes...the insults waged against local residents that are often referenced. it would be upsetting.

the "good old days" have carried over here, too...the "welcoming" tradition, for example. you know, inclusion/exclusion...junior high stuff.

i've parked my ass here without a welcome (that's called 'weaseling' to the FIT), and don't do very well with absolutes and directives.

FireCat wrote:

<quoted text>
It's my opinion--and I recognise that I've not specifically been addressed in this post--that the FIT doesn't have "a" theory, per se. The "FIT" is Weeper's unofficial and affectionate (I'd hoped) term for the posters on the forum at the time, and....as is still apparent here and on the other forum....people's opinions are all over the place and varied. Everyone has their own opinion. So I, for one, don't really feel there is "a FIT opinion," contrary to what others might think.
And that, folks, is MY personal opinion.

You are wrong. There MOST DEFINITELY was a FIT opinion and I stated it above. FIT meant adhering to the party line, no dissenters allowed. Include in the above that I have already posted the whole bit about how evil the locals were to not allow Fred to search their property, turns out only one local ever complained.