Where is MAURA MURRAY

snowy, yes, I see this.

whiston wrote:

I have been told that mr Murray has 'deemed ' Amherst not important but i and the many law enforcement people i have spoken with seem to think otherwise

I AGREE. First tenet of investigative principles. Textbook. Criminal Justice 101. Know your victim, her past, present, environment, habits etc.

Pointer wrote:

Occasionally I've found myself thinking that maybe Maura met someone new at school and decided to run away with him rather than confess her feelings to her family and Billy.

It would be Sharon that Maura couldn't face, Sharon adored Maura and Maura adored Sharon. Maura knew this would break Sharon's heart.

Anne wrote:

snowy, yes, I see this.

See what, exactly?

Anne wrote:

snowy, yes, I see this.

sorry...i do tend to harp.

Suzanne wrote:

<quoted text>
It would be Sharon that Maura couldn't face, Sharon adored Maura and Maura adored Sharon. Maura knew this would break Sharon's heart.

I agree. After seeing her for the first time on last fall's 20/20, I came away with the impression that Sharon is a very, very classy and principled person. Maybe it was just TV, but I, too, believe that anyone would rather disappoint their own family rather than someone like her. Not to say she is in any way, shape, or form even a tiny bit responsible, but it would be hard to face someone like her with the truth. If that's what happened.

Suzanne wrote:

<quoted text>
I AGREE. First tenet of investigative principles. Textbook. Criminal Justice 101. Know your victim, her past, present, environment, habits etc.

It's very likely that Maura had a secret woman friend or two, not necessarily in the sexual sense, whom she simply would not mention to her straight friends. Not trashing Maura at all, just saying she appears to have had some friendships that she might have kept quiet about to her regular, straight friends.

If Maura Murray did not drive the Saturn late Thursday night, when Vasi was injured, then who else would or could have driven it?

Do the FIT know the answer?

Suzanne wrote:

<quoted text>
The defamation, slander, libel and character assassination of SBD by FIT was in actual fact, obscene, extreme, ongoing, continuous and in my opinion actionable. FIT has done a terrible injustice not only to SBD but has no doubt influenced others to think twice before becoming Good Samaritons.

Suzanne ~
it is hard to imagine being the targets of vicious accusations and ignorant assumptions. i trust that what you and Beagle describe is not fabricated. how strange...and upsetting.

Snowy White wrote:

<quoted text>
Suzanne ~
it is hard to imagine being the targets of vicious accusations and ignorant assumptions. i trust that what you and Beagle describe is not fabricated. how strange...and upsetting.

Trust them Snowy. They speak the absolute truth.
And the few that were the most vicious should remember that many times their words can come back and bite them in the butt. I wouldn't be surprised someday to see at least one or two with missing tail feathers.

Snowy White wrote:

<quoted text>
Suzanne ~
it is hard to imagine being the targets of vicious accusations and ignorant assumptions. i trust that what you and Beagle describe is not fabricated. how strange...and upsetting.

The very notion of "fabrication" is not in play. The FIT's handiwork is obvious. The FIT's goals cannot be mistaken. Their hearts - if they have them - are filled with only hatred and loathing. People like this do not suddenly pop up because they are SO concerned about "finding Maura." They have latched themselves onto Maura's disappearance in the most underhanded ways imaginable. The Murray family did not even know the FIT (aka attack ducks) before Maura disappeared. They exist only to make Maura's disappearance more difficult to solve, not easier.

Beagle wrote:

<quoted text>
The very notion of "fabrication" is not in play. The FIT's handiwork is obvious. The FIT's goals cannot be mistaken. Their hearts - if they have them - are filled with only hatred and loathing. People like this do not suddenly pop up because they are SO concerned about "finding Maura." They have latched themselves onto Maura's disappearance in the most underhanded ways imaginable. The Murray family did not even know the FIT (aka attack ducks) before Maura disappeared. They exist only to make Maura's disappearance more difficult to solve, not easier.

just maura? and molly bish? and others, perhaps?

Maura Murray very likely had one or two lesbian friends whom she did not mention to her straight friends. Nothing necessarily sexual, but when secrets like this are kept, awkward problems sometimes arise. Maura's general reticence may have had something to do with her friends on the other side.

In Florida, Love Daisy tells Sue Ann
the streets are lined in eucalyptus,
and boutiques, well canopied for shade,
entice them all. Quite nice, they think,
her being teased into Miami’s dawn
by smoothly moving Cuban boys
who tango them in shiny shoes,
thinly wristed, ruby eyed,
first hand to hip, then lip to cheek,
accountants soon she thinks.
Her picture card lies
colors down and frozen flat
against the northern interstate
flung far enough away
for someone else’s breaking
waves to warm the cold cement.
But the aqua strokes she learned in school
permeate the writing side all the same
and her thrill in running off like that
leaves the edge in inky veins
beneath some sunned-on weeks of ice.

Snowy White wrote:

<quoted text>
just maura? and molly bish? and others, perhaps?

Sorry, don't know what you mean.

Benjamin Franklyne wrote:

Guys - no need to perform militarily precise surgical strikes starting with attack dogs and mace - serving a second course of baseball bats and finishing him off with Apache helicopters armed with nuclear weapons - when someone so much as glances at Amherst.
It makes people wonder why _that_ response.
Don't let it fool you folks - there is no ulterior motive here.
They really aren't vicious at all.
The simple truth is that Atwood probably didn't lie about seeing Maura in the car. I mean if you want to believe Atwood lied - you have to believe he just guessed that the driver was a woman when asked by the dispatcher on the phone - and that Atwood didn't actually see the man who drive the Saturn up to the accident site to misdirect the investigation.
No - don't fall for this - you'll end up wasting months of time.

Yes, the SBD likely did see Maura, but he did lie about things, and we have actually no proof of what he said to the Hanover dispatch, or if it was his wife that called, as he was no where near the phone when Haverhill call the SBD house a minute or so later?! Where did he go that he could not come to the phone? Odd! His/his wife's
report to 911 dispatch has not been released and I wrote to the District's Attorney Generals Office and requested this information and was denied. Therefore any proof of who called from the SBD and what was said is not known to us, other than what was said from Hanover to Haverhill dispatch.

It is no trap, it is what it is, SBD has told falsehoods, his motive for being untruth remains to be seen.

Perhaps it is the old story of looking for 15 minutes of fame, perhaps it was out of fear, perhaps he lies allot? No one knows except the police because he has not stepped up to the plate to explain himself to the press, the public, or Detective Healy. Perhaps the police told him to but a lid on things, and he simply couldn't resist talking to the press.

And BF, if you have just figured that it was a woman that the SBD reported seeing then perhaps
you might want to read the SBD statements a little more closely.

A grand jury might clear this matter up in a heart beat, but the wheels of justice are slow, and with a Judge telling the Murray's that "3 years is not such a long time to wait for answers in such cases" (murdered/missing, then it is understandable that the truth of what happened to Maura remains a mystery.

An obstruction of justice charge is usually what happens to someone who lies during a criminal investigation. It is a serious matter.

Initially the SBD stated to the press Maura was intoxicated, he changed his story, telling the family of Maura, the press and many others that she was not intoxicated, however the police state that the witness stated she was.

Law enforcement has refused to discuss the SBD statements, which is quoted in the press. The District Attorney's Office refuses to reveal the call to 911/dispatch Hanover.

WW, stated on this forum that he was likely told to change his story regarding the driver of the Saturn's sobriety, however she refuses to elaborate on her statement.

If my words are considered trashing someone, it is what it is, he has been caught making different statement. The police could set this matter straight, but they choose not to, and the SBD refuses to step up to the plate to explain his statement and his actions of what transpired after he left the accident scene.

This is not the only lie, but for now this will suffice to make the point that I am suspect of his statements?

No offense meant to the man, he is the author of his words, and as a member of the public I and others have the right to question his contradictory statements.

Beagle wrote:

Maura Murray very likely had one or two lesbian friends whom she did not mention to her straight friends. Nothing necessarily sexual, but when secrets like this are kept, awkward problems sometimes arise. Maura's general reticence may have had something to do with her friends on the other side.

Your point being?!
Who in this day and age does not have gay/lesbian friends, if ya don't ya got to wonder what rock a person lies under, because from my vantage point every second person you meet is or gay/lesbian, even married couples.

Beagle wrote:

<quoted text>
The very notion of "fabrication" is not in play. The FIT's handiwork is obvious. The FIT's goals cannot be mistaken. Their hearts - if they have them - are filled with only hatred and loathing. People like this do not suddenly pop up because they are SO concerned about "finding Maura." They have latched themselves onto Maura's disappearance in the most underhanded ways imaginable. The Murray family did not even know the FIT (aka attack ducks) before Maura disappeared. They exist only to make Maura's disappearance more difficult to solve, not easier.

Beagle you sound like Pike on the old forum, spitting nails. I resent your above comment,
as many people worked tirelessly for justice for
Maura and others, and saying the members of the old forum were underhanded, can't even understand this comment.

You and several others here can't see to pry yourself from the past, this is sad, as things have moved along. A cold case squad is in the works, this was the goal. We have arrived, can you and others catch up, or do ya all want to stay in the past?

paris wrote:

<quoted text>I smoke for a spell, quit and then back at 'em in times of stress. Mom has never suspected it however, so I can relate to parents not knowing. I have had to pinch a lit cig to put it out many times, and in the pocket it goes.
When I recall the quote about someone sitting at the car, smoking a cigarette,- and a man at that, I think Faith W-Man. I also think FW-man when she is later quoted as saying that she stopped looking when she saw her neighbor out there with the girl. So then there were two?
If it were me riding along with Maura, I'd be trying to get all of her things out of there while she runs ahead. If it were me, heck maybe I'd be backing the car into the snow and playing the part of Maura for the world to see. And yes, maybe smoking a butt. OR, maybe Maura is back in that truck or something, intercepted at a gas station while I and my partner in crime move her car until we get stuck and maybe I think something like SHIT, where did my wallet fall in this stolen car dammit, gotta get out of here NOW, as I also decide to grab the backpack. Why not? If committing a crime, why not make it look like the person walked away with their stuff and locked the car too?

Paris, I think this confusion stems from poor reporting, Faith initially saw a man smoking a cigarette before the SBD came along, as Faith stated in her 911 call. So from the get go
Faith perceived a man to be in the car. What is not reported initally is that Faith and her husband disagreed about what they saw, and her husband made no statement to the press that I have seen, some will correct this if in error.
We have never heard if the other members of the household were watching, the elderly Mr. Westman now deceased, and the Westman's son and daughter.
I believe the Marotte's stated they saw a woman.
There was an interesting remark made by someone, not named in the press, "After the school bus driver left the scene, Maura was no longer seen".
This statement could not have come from Faith as she alleges to have stopped watching. It could not have come from Mr. Marotte as he stated that
the driver was at the scene a minute or two before the police arrived.
So who said that the girl was no longer seen after the School Bus driver left? Or is this another reporting error?
Mason: perhaps someone has on file the distances measured by Weeper from the accident scene to the Westman's, to the SBD's house and to the corner of Bradley Hill road. Does anyone have a record of these measurements. Weeper was very specific.
Thinking out loud, question at large
Has it been determined if it is in error that Faith Westman reported to 911, as per on record in the Grafton County Sherriff's log, the car came to rest in the Westbound lane. This is important as the Saturn would have been much closer to the Westman's house if it was in the Westbound lane.
The car was reported seen backing up, who made this statement?
When did the car back up, immediately? Was it in the Westbound lane and backed up to the Eastbound lane?
If the directionality of the car is correct as per reported by Faith, her view becomes not only closer but they might have been able to see more clearly. This would change everything that we perceive of the accident, from Faith's point of elevation she would have a much better view of the accident scene. Also the person sitting in the car would have been much more visible than if the car was parked in the Eastbound lane.
Did the 911 operator make a mistake recording Faith's report?
Have we determined if Faith is in error or the 911 operator is in error. Something is not right,
Smith makes no mention of this in his report, nor is there any indication in his report of the sketch of the tire tracks that the car was ever in the Westbound lane ditch as reported by Faith?

Beagle wrote:

<quoted text>Sorry, don't know what you mean.

Beagle ~
peri has unwittingly answered my question at post #16303...

she says: "Beagle you sound like Pike on the old forum, spitting nails. I resent your above comment,
as many people worked tirelessly for justice for
Maura and others, and saying the members of the old forum were underhanded, can't even understand this comment."
********

it's no secret that several on this forum seem deeply involved in "the missing", not just the disappearance of Maura.
that is exactly why i previously posed the question of why/what motivates people to be here...for so long.
certainly, even with the most sensitive and caring and compassionate, without knowing or having met Maura, one remains one step away from her.
her immediate family, and closest constellation of friends would be the most impacted by her disappearance.
so, claims to be "family" without identifying one's relationship to Maura, then, are also questioned on this forum.
i digress.
my only point is that a group of people who moved in synch and stand to represent ALL of the missing...and not necessarily missing men and children...but young women, can at least be considered to be, generically, motivated by something in common.
clear as mud? it's too early.

the other strange aspect of all this is the intensity of the forensic-astrological element.

i'll need to sweep away some of the clutter, WTF/Bill and consider looking harder at what is evident, tangible and logical.

unedited.