Where is MAURA MURRAY

looking4amoose wrote:

<quoted text>How many unsolved cases are there in comparable states?

25 in Vermont.

FireCat wrote:

<quoted text>
It is not, as you say, "mere" questioning of the facts. Questioning of the facts is always, IMO, a good thing. Your second paragraph indicates that what you are also doing is reciprocating and escalating the anger on both sides. What purpose will that serve anyone, most of all Maura? It might make YOU feel better (and I'm not just referring to Suzanne here) but what will it do for Maura?

Thou Speaketh In Riddles Oh Fair One: You say questioning the 'facts' is ALWAYS (your word) a good thing. BUT NOT IN THE MAURA MURRAY CASE ?? Why should it be any different in this case esp when so many good people have been hurt, so many reputations damaged.

looking4amoose wrote:

Oh and btw, I wrote to the Town Manager's office (Glenn English) about the case, as well as the Chief of Police Jeff Williams. I wrote to the AG's office as well..
The point that it is a criminal case does not even come close to proving that Maura did not run away or leave of her own choice. As I said before, a crime could have occurred AFTER she left Haverhill.....maybe she wasn't even in Haverhill but rather the dogs picked up her scent from the bottoms of shoes from whomever was driving the car. Her scent would've permeated the vehicle and ANYONE sitting in it would've picked it up to some degree.
Read betweent he lines Peri. She had a troubled recent past, there were family matters going on that have not been disclosed publicly, and she up and left right after talking to her father and never said anything to him about it. Her boyfriend sensed there was something wrong, she clearly told him that she didn't feel like talking. There was more going on than has been disclosed. I am not blaming her......I'm trusting in her that she did the right thing to put that part of her life behind her.

I agree.

FireCat wrote:

<quoted text>
It is not, as you say, "mere" questioning of the facts. Questioning of the facts is always, IMO, a good thing. Your second paragraph indicates that what you are also doing is reciprocating and escalating the anger on both sides. What purpose will that serve anyone, most of all Maura? It might make YOU feel better (and I'm not just referring to Suzanne here) but what will it do for Maura?

I have every intention to continue questioning the so called force fed, spoon fed "facts". The more we are told not to question, the more I feel that something critical is being covered up and needs to be exposed.

FireCat wrote:

<quoted text>
It is not, as you say, "mere" questioning of the facts. Questioning of the facts is always, IMO, a good thing. Your second paragraph indicates that what you are also doing is reciprocating and escalating the anger on both sides. What purpose will that serve anyone, most of all Maura? It might make YOU feel better (and I'm not just referring to Suzanne here) but what will it do for Maura?

You are suggesting that it is not authoritarian or fascistic for people to attack those who disagree with them.

Firecat I wonder how you can use the word escalate in reference to me when I was the target of the most viscious, vile and bitter post from Sophiebean? Do you read selectively? Do you support those who do not want questions asked. Are you not aware that 4.5 years of rehashing the Rte 112 accident site has produced no Maura, no clue as to where she is, no hint of what might have gone on that night.

Suzanne wrote:

<quoted text>
I have every intention to continue questioning the so called force fed, spoon fed "facts". The more we are told not to question, the more I feel that something critical is being covered up and needs to be exposed.

Sigh.

1. I have never told anyone not to question facts. The most efficient way to do this is to research it yourself.(as Whiston as done. He and I are currently at an impasse because we've each received information that we trust, and that information does not agree with the other's. Thus, we will CONTINUE to question the facts until we can determine what they actually are.) The most efficient way to question facts is not, in any case, to rail against the people who have provided them and call them authoritarian. That's not questioning facts. That's railing against people and calling them authoritarian.

If you want to know the answer to a question, do what philip or I have done. Ask someone you consider an authoritative source. Don't just bitch about how you disagree with the facts, or someone's methods. Ask an actual question.

Suzanne wrote:

<quoted text>
You are suggesting that it is not authoritarian or fascistic for people to attack those who disagree with them.

2. Show me where in the post you quoted I said that. I said no such thing. If you inferred something I didn't imply, that's YOUR problem.

In fact, if I am reading correctly (and I have little doubt that if I am not, you will tell me so) you are thereby implying the opposite corollary--that it IS athoritarian of fascist for people to attack those who disagree with them.

I happen to think that in certain cases you are right.

And every time I disagree with you, you attack me.

Hmmmmmmm. What's 2 + 2 again? Oh, that's right.

Suzanne wrote:

Firecat I wonder how you can use the word escalate in reference to me when I was the target of the most viscious, vile and bitter post from Sophiebean? Do you read selectively? Do you support those who do not want questions asked. Are you not aware that 4.5 years of rehashing the Rte 112 accident site has produced no Maura, no clue as to where she is, no hint of what might have gone on that night.

I am aware that much of that time period (though I don't know that I'd say 4.5 years) has provided little concrete information TO THE PUBLIC. It's not the public I'm concerned about, it's the actual investigation. News flash: we're not the actual investigation. None of us.

Every time ANYONE fights back, it's escalation, Suzanne. It doesn't matter who hurt whom first, or who feels more attacked. And no, since you asked me bluntly, I DON'T feel you have been the subject of the more vicious things said on this forum--from sophie bean or from anyone else. I'm truly sorry you feel that way. But I think you're far from the martyr you seem to think you are.

I also stand by my position that I hope you are doing/asking/pondering more than what I see here. All I see from your posts are attacks on the family site and how awful it was. I don't see you asking actual questions (as opposed to accusatory ones) that you seriously want to know the answers to, about Maura's case. I don't see you trying to help it move FORWARD. The only thing I see you doing, to be perfectly honest, is pointing BACKWARD about how awful the MMM forums and Helena's "so-called "iron fist" was. By contrast, Wowzer and I often disagree, but s/he (sorry, can't tell by the name, Wowzer) often posts thoughtful comments or thoeries or possibilities about Maura's fate. And lord knows White Wash and I fight like cats, but she's working her ass off to find Maura. I know that to be the truth, because I've seen how much work she's done, how doggedly she persists, how fiercely she fights FOR MAURA.

The only thing you seem to be fighting for on this forum, Suzanne, is the right to be as vindictive as you want towards those with whom you don't agree, and those by whom you felt slighted when you did not agree. I apologize, because I know there's no way I can say this that will not sound like an attack. And I'm pretty sure you'll take it as such and come back at me. But I have to speak the truth as I see it. You hated the original MMM Forum and Helena because you could not do so, in your opinion. You need to grant me the same right and respect that right, even if you privately don't respect my opinion.

That's how democracy works.

Firecat...I give you an A+

FireCat wrote:

<quoted text>
. And lord knows White Wash and I fight like cats, but she's working her ass off to find Maura. I know that to be the truth......
That's how democracy works.

I agree!

Wowzer wrote:

<quoted text>
I'm sure his background was checked out thoroughly.
Not only did he drive a school bus but he also taught NH Hunter Safety Course to many of the area children.

Interesting.

elsewherebriefly wrote:

<quoted text>
25 in Vermont.

Thanks. Vermont has about half the population of NH though (as of 2007 anyway)

"Interesting", as in a "delicious tidbit"; not by way of discussion and collaboration.
Interesting, indeed, that information is expected to travel in only one direction.
M_Chaplin was also a prize...immediately insulted, he wisely disappeared...probably to lurk.

In this rats' nest of attempted manipulation and control...several are here to tap the local resources...sweet-tallking with honey and playing to targeted individuals when it suits, and selectively attacking at will.

The roles are obvious, consistent, and unproductive.
After all, Maura has yet to be found by these methods.

Suzanne, most grateful for the historical perspective in which to frame this everpresent dynamic.
The walls have been brought down. Fully exposed.

mcsmom wrote:

<quoted text>
Interesting.

Yes interesting indeed that to teach this and also drive a school bus he had to have a full background check done. Twice.
He must have passed don't you think mscmom? You really need to get a life and stop libeling innocent people.

mcsmom wrote:

<quoted text>
I agree!

What exactly do you agree on?????? That she works her ass off??
Wasn't it you a short time ago that asked WW what she had to do to get her information.
Insulting the crap out of someone and then praising them makes no sense to me.

Arguing ain't uh'gunna solve this.

Roscoe P. Coltrain

Looking4AMoose wrote:

<quoted text>Thanks. Vermont has about half the population of NH though (as of 2007 anyway)

O.K. so double the 25 and you get 50, that's still half the amount of unsolved cases as NH.

I forget to add that these cases are also over a number of decades like New Hampshire.

Suzanne wrote:

<quoted text>
I have every intention to continue questioning the so called force fed, spoon fed "facts". The more we are told not to question, the more I feel that something critical is being covered up and needs to be exposed.

then deal with the facts or antedotal information and ask some intelligent questions, no one is stopping you or anyone else from asking questions.

Personally, I don't see much contribution from you, either with lobbying for justice or trying to figure out what happened, just one rant after the other about bloody nothing, this is not about you, was never, will never be, it is about finding Maura.

I'm, impervious to insults from people who have nothing to offer but their vindictiveness and pontifications, so don't waste words on me, thanks. If I was Maura, I would not want you helping me, no offense, it is what it is, you are nasty like so many others that have crossed our paths and your purpose is anyone's guess.

The pontificators of justice and righteousness will likely blather on in your defense, well good luck with that, and good luck to you

So let us here your questions, and dispense with your alleged abuse at the hands of the Fit team or whatever....

at the end of the day, it is not about any of us, can you understand this, we simply do not matter, it is about finding Maura. Furthermore, I am done reading anyone's post who does not deal with finding out what became of Maura, and done with reply to no mind conversations and opinions.

Peter Hinkle, Rep for New Hampshire stated there were 100 unsolved murdered and missing people in the New Hampshire area in his recent announcement re: cold case squad