Where is MAURA MURRAY

Sooz wrote:

<quoted text>
Ditto to you both...why? Maura wasn't cited in the accident with the Toyota, so why all the commotion over it after she disappeared.
Correct me if I'm wrong...but without probable cause (which would be what exactly?), wouldn't a search warrant have been needed to search the car unless Fred was asked and gave his permission?

Search warrants are not required, but often sought for cover. Take this example. Police want to search a warehouse. They wait for the new warehouse employee to close up for the night while the owner is on vacation. The new hire says, "sure, look around all you want to." That's all the police need. They cannot look inside locked containers, although different federal appeals courts have applied different standards regarding what is considered locked and what is not locked.

But if a car is in a shop for repair and the person responsible for repairing it says, "sure, look around all you want to," then the police do not have to have a warrant, especially if the car door is open. If the glove box were locked and the police wanted to look inside, they would then be smart to get a warrant depending on the location of the key. If the body guy "left" the key in the glove box lock, then it might be a matter of interpretation. It depends what's at stake and who the cop is and who the judge is likely to be and and what the urgency is and a couple hundred other factors. But let's face it, some cops go by the book, others write the book themselves as they go along.

just me---Paris wrote:

<quoted text>

How long was Fred's car in the shop anyhow that police would be "all over it" taking pictures? Doesn't that seem suspect to you that they would do that, police taking pictures instead of insurance people? And really now, why the wait with the so-called evidence they took back if they were worried to start with. Can anyone think of a reason that police would take pictures of a car that slid into a pole/guardrail just because the person driving it seemingly vanished at that early point in time?

There is nothing suspect here. I have no reason to think the auto body guy was lying. I never said that insurance people were not also taking pictures. I asked him about this very thing and he said that, yes, of course, the adjuster was there. He and I even thought we might know who the adjuster was, but he couldn't recall for sure.

BeagleBart wrote:

<quoted text>
There is nothing suspect here. I have no reason to think the auto body guy was lying. I never said that insurance people were not also taking pictures. I asked him about this very thing and he said that, yes, of course, the adjuster was there. He and I even thought we might know who the adjuster was, but he couldn't recall for sure.

Thanks BeagleBart for speaking up because I wasn't doubting anything you said, just wondering why police would be acting like that

Hey, maybe police thought the two accidents could be linked to the same person/situation? Just a late night, exhausted thought :)

gvmeabrk wrote:

Anyone know what the statute (sp) of limitation is for a hit or run in Mass?

LowerSlowerDelaware posted a link to the MA statutes of limitation regulations regarding CIVIL prosecutions, but if Vasi was the victim of a hit-and-run (which seems fairly evident), then there are CRIMINAL statutes that would apply as well. Those differ from the Civil statutes.

The hit-and-run criminal laws for MA include the following:

“(1) Whoever operates a motor vehicle upon any way or in any place to which the public has right of access, or upon any way or in any place to which members of the public shall have access as invitees or licensees, and without stopping and making known his name, residence and the registration number of his motor vehicle, goes away after knowingly colliding with or otherwise causing injury to any person not resulting in the death of any person, shall be punished by imprisonment for not less than six months nor more than two years and by a fine of not less than five hundred dollars nor more than one thousand dollars.

(2) Whoever operates a motor vehicle upon any way or in any place to which the public has a right of access or upon any way or in any place to which members of the public shall have access as invitees or licensees and without stopping and making known his name, residence and the registration number of his motor vehicle, goes away to avoid prosecution or evade apprehension after knowingly colliding with or otherwise causing injury to any person shall, if the injuries result in the death of a person, be punished by imprisonment in the state prison for not less than two and one-half years nor more than ten years and by a fine of not less than one thousand dollars nor more than five thousand dollars or by imprisonment in a jail or house of correction for not less than one year nor more than two and one-half years and by a fine of not less than one thousand dollars nor more than five thousand dollars. The sentence imposed upon such person shall not be reduced to less than one year, nor suspended, nor shall any person convicted under this paragraph be eligible for probation, parole, or furlough or receive any deduction from his sentence until such person has served at least one year of such sentence; provided, however, that the commissioner of correction may on the recommendation of the warden, superintendent or other person in charge of a correctional institution, or the administrator of a county correctional institution, grant to an offender committed under this paragraph, a temporary release in the custody of an officer of such institution for the following purposes only: to attend the funeral of a relative; to visit a critically ill relative; to obtain emergency medical or psychiatric services unavailable at said institution or to engage in employment pursuant to a work release program.”

The Statutes of Limitation under Criminal law in MA are a bit lengthy and "wade through" for posting, but basically there is NO statute of limitations on murder, and the law on hit-and-run with or without a death seems to fall under the following:

"An indictment for any other crime shall be found and filed within six years after such crime has been committed; provided, however, that any period during which the defendant is not usually and publicly a resident within the commonwealth shall be excluded in determining the time limited." This would mean that if whoever hit-and-ran re Vasi went into hiding in MA or left the commonwealth of MA, that person could be indicted within a 6-year period starting when the person returns to MA or "surfaces" in MA.

Got the info from the following 2 sites:

http://www.deadlyroads.com/laws/massachusetts...

http://www.mass.gov/legis/laws/mgl/index.htm

First, thank you Elsewhere (woof) for your direction. And, of course to JMParis for your splendid work...Please convey to the young chap Vasi, appreciation for his input.(I don't care if he uses "spill chick" or types with 2 fingers. Gads, poor guy with a head injury...?
Just one bit of input, leaving MA around 4:30-5PM in February, it would be dark, who could/would see any driver on a highway. I drive the approximately 140 miles up to Woodsville in a bit under 3 hrs. What does this mean? I dunno,who would or could see Maura's beauty in the dark? Unless she stopped on 91..a Rest Area? I recall photos that Silky posted of some rest area(s)...?
Finally,I don't get why anyone would tow the car from Amherst to Woodsville..huh? why? I don't know (if only some of her friends/family could/would talk) why Maura was evidently in a
funk, perhaps she saw the handwriting on the wall, so to speak, about her future with Bill(y).
The opposite of what Anne usually says..."somebody knows"......I say, somebody ain't talking.....

Thank you, Advocator, for the important information about criminal v. civil. Good to know the clock starts ticking when the operator is found, but not sure about the owner.

What if the operator cannot be found and the Commonwealth decides to at least lean on the owner? Or just pros outright? How does that work?

The penalty for motor vehicle homicide is not a small one. Do you think the Commonwealth would bargain away leaving the scene in exchange for a guilty on the MVH charge?

BeagleBart wrote:

What if the operator cannot be found and the Commonwealth decides to at least lean on the owner? Or just pros outright? How does that work?
The penalty for motor vehicle homicide is not a small one. Do you think the Commonwealth would bargain away leaving the scene in exchange for a guilty on the MVH charge?

Don't really know the answers to these questions, but although the Commonwealth could theoretically lean on or pros the vehicle owner with regard to some matters, I tend to doubt it's done very often and methinks they wouldn't do that on a vehicular homicide. As to bargain away leaving the scene in return for a guilty plea, they probably would although the "perpetrator" might not think he/she was getting much of a deal.

.

just me---Paris wrote:

Oh, better clarify that I realize Maura's computer was taken from her dorm room and then given to Kathleen but not when the family was in NH. Wouldn't want anyone to jump to conclusions now.....

jm-paris, I did not realize the computer had ever been in the hands of any family member. I had always hoped so thinking that family would be more apt to know something or someone she had been communicating with...another thing, I cannot understand the jumbled radio quotes! What does that concern? I guess it wouldn't be too unusual to have police going over Fred's vehicle with the adjuster right there. Thank you for communicating with Petri Vasi and many thanks to him for sharing.

Hello all,

Firstly:
Shame on the poster who thought it fit to bash Petrit Vasi for his spelling.
Mr Vasi should of course be commended for speaking out on what surely must be a very emotionally painful part of his life.
Thank you Petrit.

Secondly:
Shack,
I believe you must have mis-interpreted what I wrote recently regarding the rather surprising fact that Maura appears not having been seen/noticed during her 3-hours drive north from Amherst to Haverhill - if she indeed drove the Saturn there at all.

What I was referring to was simply that she should have been seen/noticed by other people on her way north, should she have stopped somewhere along the Interstate.
Her beauty does play a role here in the sense that it would certainly contribute to her being noticed by people, in a way which a more ordinary-looking young lady would not.

This leads me to think that Maura either did not stop anywhere while enroute from Amherst to Haverhill, OR that she never made that journey herself.

Another thing:

It never ceases to amaze me that no friends or acquaintances of Maura´s appear to be contributing on this board, the former MMM board or any other Maura forum(s) that I know of.
I can´t really figure out the reason for this being so, but the apparent lack of any such contributions seems somewhat surprising in my mind.

Lastly:
Could this lady possibly be Maura´s elder sister Julie, or is this just a matter of "same name" -"wrong" person?
The link is:
www.boozallen.com
Search word: "Julie Murray"

Thanks!

Eurobserver wrote:

Another thing:
It never ceases to amaze me that no friends or acquaintances of Maura´s appear to be contributing on this board, the former MMM board or any other Maura forum(s) that I know of.
I can´t really figure out the reason for this being so, but the apparent lack of any such contributions seems somewhat surprising in my mind.
Lastly:
Could this lady possibly be Maura´s elder sister Julie, or is this just a matter of "same name" -"wrong" person?
The link is:
www.boozallen.com
Search word: "Julie Murray"
Thanks!

Euro, It has crossed my mind that a Grand Jury might be sitting in Hampshire County. In some cases, a Grand Jury consists of only one person, usually a judge. Secrecy is often a major factor.

For about a half century Booz Allen has had a very cozy relationship with various U.S. government agencies over the years. It's really a well known revolving door. This ain't no conspiracy theory stuff. This is old, old news to watchers of the Beltway Plus (i.e., the anti-terrorism-industrial complex that thrives around DC). Nice find. Very reminiscent of a WP gent I know, MH, who turned Wall St. "swindler," and who has a rather unique connection to the missing Sinclairs.

In fact, MH is partners, so to speak, with ML, who was a "corporate officer" in a business CEO'd by A. Murray Sinclair (Vista Gold). ML actually held the paper on the property where the Sinclairs were living when they disappeared in Feb 2001. ML bought the property outright in 2006. I'm personally acquainted with both of these guys. Small world, indeed.

Firecat,

That's what struck me as well.

Eurobserver,

In respect to Maura's case..........

Sharon R, Billy's mother and Maura's future mother in law, notified Maura's forum members on more than on occasion that the MA authorities were placed on 'Gag Order' by the NHSP.

This was mentioned when Philip attempted to contact one of the galleries and his e-mail was forwarded to a Detective with the Amherst Police Department.

Given that the FBI aided the MA authorities in devising a timeline for the weeks following up to Maura's departure from Amherst this would mean that the majority of Maura's family, friends, fellow students, co-workers, etc. were interviewed and very likely told not to discuss the case - placed on gag order.

I noticed that the bus driver declined to comment on Maura's case while being interviewed at his new residence in Florida.

Excerpt from April 14, 2007 Valley News

While on the stand Strelzin said,“We want to know what they know firsthand as opposed to what they know from the public or the press”.“It’s very important device for us to tell who knows things and who’s a liar.”

Potentially every Piece of evidence could be important in the future,” Stelzin said.“I don’t know what the potential defendant will do”.

Shack,

Anytime! Plugging all of Helena's hard work and dedication to Maura and her cause is always a pleasure. Lord knows, Helena almost died (she was in a coma for a month and it was an induced coma no less) while trying to moderate Maura's forum pretty much single handedly.

I bought Beau one of those collars with a little box and a remote. He's a nimrod no more, hooray!

BeagleBart,

Thanks for your comments (Post # 1851).

It has struck me again and again how very little, if anything, we know about Maura´s three (?) terms at West Point, just as we know so little about her time at UMass Amherst.

Isn´t it quite feasible that whatever happened to Maura may well have its roots back at West Point?
With Maura and her sister Julie being there at the same time (more or less) it would not seem out of bounds or wildly fanciful at all.
Just consider the sheer amount of people that Maura must have come into contact with while at West Point over three terms.

Anybody here who has ever seen any kind of media references to Maura´s time at West Point, apart from just brief pointers to her studies there???
I certainly haven´t.

Perhaps this is also deemed to be "unimportant", just like the "mystery" gallery at Amherst.
No, I´m not the least keen on "conspiracy theories" - quite the contrary, actually - but the almost complete lack of information regarding Maura´s time at Amherst and West Point bothers me.

As a media professional I find this situation very intriguing indeed, I must confess.
Why is it that seemingly none of the many excellent regional media in New England has embarked on any kind of journalistic "digging" here?
Any NHSP "gag" order could not possibly apply to the media of the entire New England region...
It´s probably nothing more, however, than a case of Maura´s fate being "down-graded" by the editors and not considered priority anymore. That´s the media world...

Another thing on a more positive note:

I´m coming back to the purported sighting of a Maura look-alike in a Barton, VT, church on Fathers´Day in June 2005.
The name of the witness - an esteemed member of the church congregation - who briefly spoke to the young lady, calling herself Racquel or Rachel, has been mentioned several times in various media and also on the former MMM Forum.
I have made a note of it somewhere, but don´t seem to find it right now. I´m sure that many of you onboard our forum knows it.

Being half a world away, I´m regrettably unable to do any foot-work here myself, but perhaps some of our contributors here may be living within a reasonable distance of Barton, VT?

I strongly feel that this possible sighting of Maura should be followed up much more closely than is at present publicly known.
Ideally, the church witness should be interviewed anew while being shown as many pictures as possible of Maura. Remember that he spoke of the young lady´s "unmistakable runners legs" and about her "fleeing" the church upon hearing the minister mentioning fathers in his sermon.
Very suggestive little things to me...

Thanks!

Anne wrote:

<quoted text>
jm-paris, I did not realize the computer had ever been in the hands of any family member. I had always hoped so thinking that family would be more apt to know something or someone she had been communicating with...another thing, I cannot understand the jumbled radio quotes! What does that concern? I guess it wouldn't be too unusual to have police going over Fred's vehicle with the adjuster right there. Thank you for communicating with Petri Vasi and many thanks to him for sharing.

You're welcome Anne and good to be saying hello. Petrit and I are still talking and I have more to say about this pretty soon. Were you able to hear the radio broadcast on that link? Right under the the box is an option to have the full dialog, that's where I got the words. I read them too and thought, huh? But none the less, that's what was there if you look. I wrote to ask who was speaking, no answer yet but the voice was familiar.

Euro, Thanks for your help. You've been a real inspiration.

Hi all, Just wanted to remind you how easy it is to change your locations if you get my drift

got it a long time ago...but thanks.

It has always amazed me as well that the family does not post. It might be said that they are still too upset or that they cannot bear to deal with cold-hearted posters who malign the good name of their beloved Maura; but, no matter how many times I have looked at, it still reflects poorly on the family that they do not post. One would expect them to post like mad in an effort to keep people interested in finding Maura. Their lack of posting also makes it seem like they have something to hide.

BeagleBart wrote:

<quoted text>
Euro, It has crossed my mind that a Grand Jury might be sitting in Hampshire County. In some cases, a Grand Jury consists of only one person, usually a judge. Secrecy is often a major factor.
For about a half century Booz Allen has had a very cozy relationship with various U.S. government agencies over the years. It's really a well known revolving door. This ain't no conspiracy theory stuff. This is old, old news to watchers of the Beltway Plus (i.e., the anti-terrorism-industrial complex that thrives around DC). Nice find. Very reminiscent of a WP gent I know, MH, who turned Wall St. "swindler," and who has a rather unique connection to the missing Sinclairs.
In fact, MH is partners, so to speak, with ML, who was a "corporate officer" in a business CEO'd by A. Murray Sinclair (Vista Gold). ML actually held the paper on the property where the Sinclairs were living when they disappeared in Feb 2001. ML bought the property outright in 2006. I'm personally acquainted with both of these guys. Small world, indeed.

Euro, I remember the sighting of which you speak--most notably that the young woman spelled her name Raykel or Raykell. I remember it because I'd never seen it or heard of it before. I think it's just one L.

I'm not local to that area, though, so I can't do any actual shoe-leather work, only the virtual kind.

Hello all,

I´m sorry for repeating myself here, but is there anybody at all "computer-savvy" around on this board, who may be able to put up a picture of Maura on her "Wikipedia" web encyclopaedia page?

I have the feeling that uploading a photo of Maura on that particular site might prove very helpful, considering the vast amount of traffic on the Wikipedia web site.
There is also a link for Maura from the "People who have disappeared" headline on the Wikipedia Internet site.
This is the page where I first learnt of Maura´s case early this year. Out of so tragically many similar cases she somehow tugged at my heart strings and here I am now....

BeagleBart,
Thanks for your encouraging words - much appreciated.