Where is MAURA MURRAY

John wrote:

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This is actually wrong, in terms of the rights issue. If without invading privacy, I can ascertain your identity when I pass you on the street or you give me your business card, there is no legal issue. Same in a forum. The legal issue would be if you tricked someone into revealing info about themselves then discovered their identity thereby. But if someone one tells you who is he is on a public forum and you doubt it and check it out based on publicly availabe info, there is no legal problem.

Mason provided contact information as Fred Leatherman...presumably, verifying that information was not an invasion of privacy.

To ask/solicit someone to register on a forum with the expressed intent and purpose of verifying the identity of that individual crosses boundaries, IMO.

I have minimal use for lawyers, but I do have common sense.

Snowy White wrote:

The personal attacks at posts #14789 and 90 are unwarranted. Consistently accusing others, or stating there is generalized paranoia is not helpful, and it is offensive.
This is a conversation about the potential for violations of privacy.
Given registration is required at the "new" forum, there is POTENTIAL for accessing or facilitating another to access identifying information, whereas with Topix, anonymity is more secure.

Facts are always seem to be personal offenses to Snowy. Its not a matter of being Mr. Good Guy protector - in this case its simple distortion.

Topix says right there where your Internet connection is, Gloucester, MA. That comes from your IP address.

Every time you send an email - you send an IP address. That's the protocol that's been used for about as long as the public has had access to the Internet. The only answer an IP number provides is a location - "Gloucester, MA"

Snowy wants us to believe that the same result - knowing that a message came from a computer in "Gloucester, MA" - is somehow a violation of privacy, but Topix showing your city is not.

Snowy also wants you to believe that my calling Dawn's statement a distortion is an attack. Its not an attack. Its a fact - my email IP check had nothing to do with Advocator's forum.

Your just taking advantaqge of the fact that IP addresses are not commonly understood and playing on unfounded fear.

He sent me his name. I never asked and wouldn't. Everyone who has shared their name has only been a first name and they all know I have never put it on the forum. I would change my moniker - but I have already posted with this - to keep it simple - I will just keep it.

Now.......... Has anyone gone to the court house?????????? Please!

What is sad is I plan on following up.. But I feel I will only get slammed for actually verifying the few facts we have.

For one - the phone call is NOT accurate.

I have offered for an engineer to talk to someone ( Ben) about this - to make it so they don't know who you are - set up a yahoo account that is NOT you. If your paranoid go to the library and send an email - he can provide his number - you can *67 block your number and he can tell you what I am saying is correct.

You could also find this out by going to your local wireless store - I think the Casey Anthony and Kobe Bryant case proved this as well.

Common sense.

John, I failed to note the post that has been the foundation for several of my postings today. It is #14668 and includes the following sentences:

"Please sign up on the other forum so private messages can be sent to you and you identity can be confirmed."

and

"If you are who you say you are - you can join the other forum where your IP can validate who you are."

John,

I wasn't wearing my clamming boots while scrolling through the posts but I did catch where you mentioned possibly taking a trip up to New England.

Please do not hesitate to PM me at the other site if you have any questions about the facts pertaining to Maura's investigation. I may not have all the answers but I'd be more than happy to assist you in wading through the muddle and mayhem.

Benjamin Franklyne wrote:

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Your just taking advantaqge of the fact that IP addresses are not commonly understood and playing on unfounded fear.

As always BF has his act together and as someone else mentioned. I am no expert either but this much I am pretty certain. Your IP address only goes as far as the server (which by the way is probably the address listed in most cases also). You can't get any more information unless the company (almost always by court order) allows that information to be released. What you can do is tell if all the people who say they are repeatedly come from the same IP and ban that IP if you are trying to ban someone. You still don't know who that is at the IP, just that its the same IP.

Don't give personal information out over the internet but forget about someone identifing you from your IP. Unless you constantly use that same IP and have told lots of other about your personal information.

Bill (Not my real name by the way)

I've been doing this too long to give any information about myself out.

Wowzer wrote:

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I believe it even takes a court order to get IP addresses from a forum administrater yet you and Ben think you have the right to trace people without one.
OMG I hope someone with authority is reading this and puts a stop to what you are doing.

Again - every time you send an email you send an IP address with it. You don't have to go to court to read an email. That's information the sender provides with the email.

Every computer the email goes to attaches an IP address. These numbers add from bottom to top, which contains the phycical location of the email's final destination.

This is a forum, not email. Instead of placing an IP address in headers (most people don't look at)- Topix converts your IP number into the name of the city in which your Internet connection resides, and places it below your name.

Benjamin Franklyne wrote:

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Facts are always seem to be personal offenses to Snowy. Its not a matter of being Mr. Good Guy protector - in this case its simple distortion.
Topix says right there where your Internet connection is, Gloucester, MA. That comes from your IP address.
Every time you send an email - you send an IP address. That's the protocol that's been used for about as long as the public has had access to the Internet. The only answer an IP number provides is a location - "Gloucester, MA"
Snowy wants us to believe that the same result - knowing that a message came from a computer in "Gloucester, MA" - is somehow a violation of privacy, but Topix showing your city is not.
Snowy also wants you to believe that my calling Dawn's statement a distortion is an attack. Its not an attack. Its a fact - my email IP check had nothing to do with Advocator's forum.
Your just taking advantaqge of the fact that IP addresses are not commonly understood and playing on unfounded fear.

Nonsense.

Again, here is an unwarranted personal attack; this time it is directed against me. I sense your unfounded and unreasonable hostility toward me, and so I don't have any particular need to engage in conversation with you.

I have stated my position on this and every other matter quite clearly, BF, and to the very best of my ability. I endeavor to communicate very well, and I often succeed....except to you.

I am beginning to understand Johnny Bravado's frustration, except I am being more polite.

Just heard on the scanner at 2 pm est.

BOL for missing Derby Vt. man who left Vt. to go to Mass. on 2/9/09 and was to return on 2/16/09. Described as 6' tall, Hazel eyes, brown hair about 220#. Driving a green SATURN station wagon with VT. plate EPA 217. I missed the name, I am looking for that now.

This was a BOL put out over the scanner by Derby, VT. LE.

I will update when I have more info.

Snowy White wrote:

John, I failed to note the post that has been the foundation for several of my postings today. It is #14668 and includes the following sentences:
"Please sign up on the other forum so private messages can be sent to you and you identity can be confirmed."
and
"If you are who you say you are - you can join the other forum where your IP can validate who you are."

Snowy - do you have an IP in your wallet or an inch under your skin? Government issued IP number that you use for identification to get a job, go to the bank? No. You do have a phone number. You have an area code. That area code says something about where your phone service is located.

Having an IP number can't identify a person on its own. IP numbers don't have your name attached to it - unless someone goes to your ISP with a court order and asks "One of your customers was using ip number 62.621.621.621 on such and such a date. Who was that? Then they will check to see who logged in and was using that IP number at the time. Circumventing the legal process there is a privacy violation.

But in Mason's situation, he is from a small enough town with a unique enough name that its reasonable to conclude that he's not an imposter if you can tell he is talking to you from Peducah.

One thing that is forgotten is that Mason actually thanked me after checking the IP number - he thanked me because people were whispering to each other in the background that he is an imposter, but this - along with the Washington State Bar's records contradict that belief.

All of this over a poster that has an opinion - that if you disagree with a post - and I have disagreed with Mason before - you can simply state why you disagree.

Judge the post, not the poster.

Dawn wrote:

Now.......... Has anyone gone to the court house?????????? Please!

Dawn,

This is one of the things I've regretted about living so far away. I have often wanted to do the actual research at the Grafton County Courthouse as well as some other research in Concord.

In saying this, upon the Supreme Court Decision Frederick Murray vs. NH State Police, Special Investigations Unit & Attorney General I believe I read that all files and documentation pertaining to Maura's investigation was forwarded to the attorney general's office.

I was very surprised when White Wash posted the affidavit but figured it might have simply slipped through the cracks.

I would believe that any documents filed at the court would fall under the revised FOIA. As I stated before Mr. Murray himself was the one who set precendent with the Right To Know Law in NH.

Here's an explanation you may need, BF, to help clarify...since you occasionally snarl at me, presumably from your own misconceptions about who I may be.

"Snowy White" refers to the owls I adore and to the color of my straight, shiny hair.
Although I may seem outspoken or passionate in stating my opinions, my moniker is not intended to make me seem any more virtuous than you or anyone else.
Nor have I set out to annoy you, or anyone else.

Chill.

One thing I would like to say - WTF, BF and Beagle - who have done extensive research - or know computers VERY well.

Have never disputed my information on the phone call. I worked with CDMA technology for about 10 of my 11 years. It was first done with a beta test - employees used the network to watch see how stable it was before fully switching off analog - which Sprint was never on the analog platform

Det C.......... I hope the family gets closure. Please update us. Not something that would be easy for the family to read. I hope its good news........

11 years at Verizon/US west New Vecto/AirTouch/Vodaphone Airtouch - prior to VZ then worked on GSM - I am now landline or voice over IP. So if a landline call it went through the CO central office.

all traceable

I have checked the VT SP website, but no info there yet. I have also googled it but have had no luck locating the young mans name. He is 25 yrs old.

Columbo....

Snowy White wrote:

John, I failed to note the post that has been the foundation for several of my postings today. It is #14668 and includes the following sentences:
"Please sign up on the other forum so private messages can be sent to you and you identity can be confirmed."
and
"If you are who you say you are - you can join the other forum where your IP can validate who you are."

Here, listen, BF. My problem is the content of Dawn's post. It's not about you, or me, or Dawn as individuals.

Regardless of whether Dawn is able, SHE IS WILLING and states her intention to "...validate who you are." This, in clear reference to Johnny Bravado.

Dawn's INTENT is a problem to some, though perhaps not to others.
Johnny Bravado can rush over to the "new" forum to help her out...or not. His choice.

I wouldn't. My choice.

Wowzer wrote:

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With all due respect Firecat if someone is going to the trouble of getting people to e-mail them thru a PM system to gain their IP addresses so they can find their identity then IMO that is not being paranoid at all. There is every reason to be fearful. People have been murdered, raped and kidnapped when their online identity was found out.I hope you are not making this out to be "just a swell of paranoia and mistrust" as it is very real and everyone that has used the PM system on the other site should be very upset.

Oh dear--that's not what I was referring to at all, Wowzer! I'm so sorry I wasn't clear and you misunderstood. I was referring more to some of the other stuff going on here exclusively, in the past couple of days. What you mention is only peripherally connected to it....and yes, the thought that someone might monitor my computer usage IN GENERAL freaks me out. I'm not a big fan of Homeland Security wanting access to my library checkout history, either. I totally understand that some people are worried, and why they might be.

I think I just expressed myself really badly, is all. But there HAS been a lot of jumpiness on this forum lately, and only some of it is related to that. I wasn't referring to you when I alluded to the "paranoia" either. Sorry if you thought I was! We frequently disagree, but I respect you and your opinions, and a lot of what you say has logic that cannot be denied. Sometimes I *do* agree with you.(because I'm not attached to the idea of being right...just the idea of finding out what is right)

Again my apologies. Open mouth, insert foot/keyboard/whatever.

Wowzer wrote:

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I believe it even takes a court order to get IP addresses from a forum administrater

Actually it doesn't. Well, from a forum administrator, if it doesn't coincide with the forum's privacy rules, it might.

But it does NOT take a court order to find out someone's IP address on your own. All it takes is a minimal knowledge of computers (which I don't possess but I understand is fairly easy).

I am not saying this to minimize your concerns of privacy at all. However, it seems to me that you're so upset over the issue that you're not reading and understanding the situation clearly.

Snowy White wrote:

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My IP was posted on Topix without my permission.
Very personal information was also posted about someone in the Franconia community.
There was no direct action taken by Topix relative to these specific issues by the Topix Gods in the past when notified, either by way of flagging and/or direct communication with Topix.
These are serious issues; I remain less satisfied than you with the outcome of flagging.

Holy cow. I totally missed this. Was it on this board? I don't frequent other forums on Topix.

You're right, these ARE serious issues. I'm not sure how traceable your IP address is since you are a registered member.(and I have no idea why when I'm at home, my location only comes up as "United States.")

How totally not cool.