Where is MAURA MURRAY

Back to Pamela Webb, please.

It was claimed here that her cause of death was strangulation. This is not true, according to official reprts. I ask again, where did you get this information? If you are wrong, you should say so. This is precisely the sort of false "information" that continues to lead us down irrelevant paths.

EWB, I did not know about that. My initial thoughts on reading about the missing body parts was that the body had been there awhile, and animals could have gotten at the remains. The information about possible corresponding and unidentified body parts being found in MA is very disturbing indeed. If those remains are those missing from Ms Webb's body, that would be a very sick and very specifically deranged inidividual.

In our search for Maura, it is true that we need to focus on defined areas. I would say that there are places around WRJ that should be searched, because it's a major hub of transportation and has a lot of travel services. I would say that there are places around Wells River that should be searched, especially between I-91 and Rt. 5 and the town. I would think that there are areas near major hiking trails that should be searched, perhaps near Lost River. I don't know or really want to know if any of those areas have yet been searched. These are all locations, or similar sorts of locations, to those where murder victims have been found.

I am still puzzled why there seems to be little interest here in both Nicholaou and Rooney. Is it possible that either / both were in the Franconia area on Feb 9, 2004? I have never heard that fully discussed.

Also, I don't know how many remember the victim of the "Interstate Rapist" who may be Lovie Riddle, who came here and asked us to consider the possibility of Riddle being involved. That has never been pursued, to my knowledge anyway.

As far as I know, ALL victims of the CT Valley Killer (who remains unidentified and at large) were victims of "chance and opportunity" by a killer who was extremely familiar with the area and was looking for victims in specific locations. When you consider that, the element of so-called randomness is almost eliminated. The most obvious case in point, for me, is Barbara Agnew.
Would anyone seriously ask "What are the odds that a woman driving alone who stops at a rest area late at night would become a victim of a serial killer?" ?

sophie bean wrote:

Back to Pamela Webb, please.
It was claimed here that her cause of death was strangulation. This is not true, according to official reprts. I ask again, where did you get this information? If you are wrong, you should say so. This is precisely the sort of false "information" that continues to lead us down irrelevant paths.
EWB, I did not know about that. My initial thoughts on reading about the missing body parts was that the body had been there awhile, and animals could have gotten at the remains. The information about possible corresponding and unidentified body parts being found in MA is very disturbing indeed. If those remains are those missing from Ms Webb's body, that would be a very sick and very specifically deranged inidividual.
In our search for Maura, it is true that we need to focus on defined areas. I would say that there are places around WRJ that should be searched, because it's a major hub of transportation and has a lot of travel services. I would say that there are places around Wells River that should be searched, especially between I-91 and Rt. 5 and the town. I would think that there are areas near major hiking trails that should be searched, perhaps near Lost River. I don't know or really want to know if any of those areas have yet been searched. These are all locations, or similar sorts of locations, to those where murder victims have been found.
I am still puzzled why there seems to be little interest here in both Nicholaou and Rooney. Is it possible that either / both were in the Franconia area on Feb 9, 2004? I have never heard that fully discussed.
Also, I don't know how many remember the victim of the "Interstate Rapist" who may be Lovie Riddle, who came here and asked us to consider the possibility of Riddle being involved. That has never been pursued, to my knowledge anyway.
As far as I know, ALL victims of the CT Valley Killer (who remains unidentified and at large) were victims of "chance and opportunity" by a killer who was extremely familiar with the area and was looking for victims in specific locations. When you consider that, the element of so-called randomness is almost eliminated. The most obvious case in point, for me, is Barbara Agnew.
Would anyone seriously ask "What are the odds that a woman driving alone who stops at a rest area late at night would become a victim of a serial killer?" ?

i am impatient.
the likelihood of a serial killer being at the very place and the very time where Maura was located along her travel route is improbable.

an abduction by chance/opportunity seems more likely to me.

in either event, if she was abducted and killed, her body needs to be found. knowing where to look is as great a challenge as knowing who might have taken her.

rooney's crime of opportunity led him to leave the body in the area where he killed his victim.
where do you begin to look in a national forest?

if she was abducted and held, the prospect of her reappearance after 5 years is more hopeful.

sophie bean wrote:

As far as I know, ALL victims of the CT Valley Killer (who remains unidentified and at large) were victims of "chance and opportunity" by a killer who was extremely familiar with the area and was looking for victims in specific locations.

Just curious. What law enforcement agency (Federal, state, local) is talking about a serial killer dubbed the CT Valley Killer???

Bill

FYI #1

http://www.cbc.ca/news/background/crime/targe...

Mason, do you have knowledge, from your expertise, what percent of all murders are committed by serial killers?

sophie bean wrote:

Back to Pamela Webb, please.
It was claimed here that her cause of death was strangulation. This is not true, according to official reprts. I ask again, where did you get this information? If you are wrong, you should say so. This is precisely the sort of false "information" that continues to lead us down irrelevant paths.
EWB, I did not know about that. My initial thoughts on reading about the missing body parts was that the body had been there awhile, and animals could have gotten at the remains. The information about possible corresponding and unidentified body parts being found in MA is very disturbing indeed. If those remains are those missing from Ms Webb's body, that would be a very sick and very specifically deranged inidividual.
In our search for Maura, it is true that we need to focus on defined areas. I would say that there are places around WRJ that should be searched, because it's a major hub of transportation and has a lot of travel services. I would say that there are places around Wells River that should be searched, especially between I-91 and Rt. 5 and the town. I would think that there are areas near major hiking trails that should be searched, perhaps near Lost River. I don't know or really want to know if any of those areas have yet been searched. These are all locations, or similar sorts of locations, to those where murder victims have been found.
I am still puzzled why there seems to be little interest here in both Nicholaou and Rooney. Is it possible that either / both were in the Franconia area on Feb 9, 2004? I have never heard that fully discussed.
Also, I don't know how many remember the victim of the "Interstate Rapist" who may be Lovie Riddle, who came here and asked us to consider the possibility of Riddle being involved. That has never been pursued, to my knowledge anyway.
As far as I know, ALL victims of the CT Valley Killer (who remains unidentified and at large) were victims of "chance and opportunity" by a killer who was extremely familiar with the area and was looking for victims in specific locations. When you consider that, the element of so-called randomness is almost eliminated. The most obvious case in point, for me, is Barbara Agnew.
Would anyone seriously ask "What are the odds that a woman driving alone who stops at a rest area late at night would become a victim of a serial killer?" ?

Strangulation was stated on Silky's site.
***As far as I know, ALL victims of the CT Valley Killer (who remains unidentified and at large) were victims of "chance and opportunity" by a killer who was extremely familiar with the area and was looking for victims in specific locations.***
Sophie can you post a link as to where you found this information? I'd be very intereseted in reading about it. Thanks

http://video.aol.com/video-detail/connecticut...

http://video.aol.com/video-detail/connecticut...

http://video.aol.com/video-detail/connecticut...

Mason wrote:

EB,
RE: the remains found near the rest stop on Route 78 in Warwick on June 24, 1989.
Pamela Webb disappeared on July 1, 1989.
Do you know if those remains have been matched up to a missing person?
Fred

No Mason,

The information out of Warwick, Ma. was something I happened across just other day! Your bringing up Pamela web prompted me to remember, scour back through my google searches, and post it.

I am not sure if MA/NH/ME/VT shared information on these types of cases back during the late eighties. They must now, right????

sophie bean wrote:

Back to Pamela Webb, please.

My very distant grandparent Christopher Webb, clerk of Braintree, thanks you.

elsewherebriefly wrote:

<quoted text>
No Mason,
The information out of Warwick, Ma. was something I happened across just other day! Your bringing up Pamela web prompted me to remember, scour back through my google searches, and post it.
I am not sure if MA/NH/ME/VT shared information on these types of cases back during the late eighties. They must now, right????

Oops, I went back and re-read the dates. I didn't think at first they corresponded with Pamela Webb's disappearance. Again, sorry for my error.

No, I do not believe they have been identified or linked to any other missing persons as of yet. I found the information on a recent cold case blog.

I did read there was speculation the remains may have been Nicholeau's wife who went missing during this time frame.

Sophie Bean,

Given there were just days between Pamela's disappearance and the discovery of her partial remains I had always believed her body had been mutilated in an effort to remove trace evidence.

Please also note, her underwear were not listed amidst the items of clothing found with her remains.

As I am sure everyone is aware, missing women's underwear is bothersome to me.

Especially considering how many sightings of women's underwear we've had pertaining to Maura.

WTF-the-original wrote:

<quoted text>
Just curious. What law enforcement agency (Federal, state, local) is talking about a serial killer dubbed the CT Valley Killer???
Bill

Bill, the point is that it seems reasonably obvious that at least 13 women in the CT River Valley, within a very small geographical area, were located and targeted in identical ways, vanished under similar circumstances, and their remains, in several cases, were found very close together and in a short period of time. Can you possibly believe that all of that is nothing more than coincidence?

sophie bean wrote:

Back to Pamela Webb, please.
It was claimed here that her cause of death was strangulation. This is not true, according to official reprts. I ask again, where did you get this information? If you are wrong, you should say so. This is precisely the sort of false "information" that continues to lead us down irrelevant paths.
<SNIP>
I am still puzzled why there seems to be little interest here in both Nicholaou and Rooney. Is it possible that either / both were in the Franconia area on Feb 9, 2004? I have never heard that fully discussed.
<SNIP>

Sophie Bean,

RE: Your post about strangulation.

I answered your's and Lady Gray's posts last night regarding strangulation in message # 15707, which I posted 15 hours ago. It's on the previous page. You must not have read it because you would not have asked me again today, if you had. Go back and read it, please.

RE: Nicholaou & Rooney

I discussed Nicholaou, the Connecticut River Valley Murders, and his whereabouts in February, 2004. in message % 15691, which is two pages back.

I haven't mentioned dear old Lovie Rooney because I need to go back and review jmlh's posts. I believe she said he was not in prison in February, 2004. I will post what I find out.

Fred

Snowy White wrote:

Mason, do you have knowledge, from your expertise, what percent of all murders are committed by serial killers?

I don't and I don't believe anyone else does either. Lots of people have speculated about it, but I don't think anyone has crunched the numbers and published a study in a peer reviewed article. That would be difficult to do, given the numbers of missing people and unsolved murders.

My guess is serial killers are responsible for less than 10%, and probably less than 5% of the murders nationwide each year.

Mason wrote:

<quoted text>
Sophie Bean,
RE: Your post about strangulation.
I answered your's and Lady Gray's posts last night regarding strangulation in message # 15707, which I posted 15 hours ago. It's on the previous page. You must not have read it because you would not have asked me again today, if you had....Fred

Mason, I too did not see your post on this, and I just went back to look at post # 15707 and it's not there. I see # 15706 and #15708, but no #15707. Have no doubt at all that you posted it, but it's odd that it's not there. Why would anyone from Topix delete that post? Or could there have been a Topix server glitch?

If y'all check out Silky Boxer's website listing 49 unsolved murders in New England, as I did, you should be able to figure out which ones were victims of the so-called Connecticut River Valley Killer. Plus, the exercise will get your inner detective going and you may need the practice to solve Maura's disappearance.

Look for patterns, connections, and modus operandi. I'll give y'all clue to get started. Start with Claremont, NH on Silky's map.

Pending a response from Detective Columbo or Weeper about the flat tire on the Saturn, we may be way out in front of LE and the PIs in this investigation.

Fred

Advocator wrote:

<quoted text>
Mason, I too did not see your post on this, and I just went back to look at post # 15707 and it's not there. I see # 15706 and #15708, but no #15707. Have no doubt at all that you posted it, but it's odd that it's not there. Why would anyone from Topix delete that post? Or could there have been a Topix server glitch?

I don't know, but I just checked and it's there. Try refreshing the page. Maybe that will work.

Fred

When I posted 15708, 15707 was not there.

Damn, Mason, you're right -#15707 is NOT there - it hops from #15706 to #15708.
Coincidence?
An internal Topix glitch?
I guess, but considering the question is an official inquest report of cause of death in a homicide, it's quite odd that the answer should be so elusive. The Union Leader article states that cause of death could not be determined -Silky's site says that it was death by strangulation. Something definitely does not add up here.

elsewherebriefly wrote:

<quoted text>
No Mason,
The information out of Warwick, Ma. was something I happened across just other day! Your bringing up Pamela web prompted me to remember, scour back through my google searches, and post it.
I am not sure if MA/NH/ME/VT shared information on these types of cases back during the late eighties. They must now, right????

They certainly should be, but I wouldn't bet the ranch. T think we should point out the similarities between Webb and the two cases you found to the LE agencies handling those investigations, just to be on the safe side.

BTW, I plotted the locations last night where Webb's abandoned p/u was found on the Maine Turnpike and the place where the killer disposed of her body.

80 miles apart as the crow flies. Two possible routes to take to get there. One is 130 miles. The other is 165 miles. Both are approximately 3-hour drives. The killer apparently likes to dispose of the bodies long distances from the locations where he abducts them.

Take a look at Warwick, MA. It's not close to anything except the NH border and hardly anyone lives in that area. The unidentified victim certainly wasn't abducted anywhere near Warwick.

Based on the 2115 time stamp on Webb's turnpike ticket when she entered the turnpike in Augusta, ME and the location where her p/u was discovered (80 miles south of Augusta & 30 miles north of Portsmouth), Webb probably was abducted a little before midnight on July 1, 1989.

The dismembered body of an unidentified person was discovered in Warwick on June 24, 1989.

That's only 7 days apart! If the same person committed both murders, which appears likely since both victims were dismembered, he was doing a hell of a lot of driving to separate abduction sites from body recovery sites, wasn't he?

Was Webb killed as she was attempting to change the flat tire, given the blood found on the road next to her vehicle?

Where and when did he dismember her? If he drove directly to the place where her body was discovered 17 days later, he would have arrived around 3 to 3:30 am.

If he sabotaged the tire on her p/u, did he drive all the way to Augusta to hunt for a victim? I don't know where she stopped for gas, BTW.

This guy really knows his geography.

Disturbing stuff.

Fred