Where is MAURA MURRAY

Hello Columbo; Are there any new clues
to finding MAura Murray. Did you meet with Fred on Feb 9th- the five year anniversary?

Sincerely,
Susan

Here's message #15707. It appears on my screen, but no one can see it, apparently. They may have invisibleized it because of the links. I'll try again.

sophie bean wrote:
Cause of death for Pamela Webb could NOT be determined, as there was (as you note above) not enough soft tissue or other evidencde remaining to determine. Where did you get the information that cause of death was strangulation?

The source listing strangulation as the cause of death is:
ht
tp:/
/snewzer
.tripod.
com/id1.html

This is Beth's site that also has the map that marks locations where bodies were found with little red circles that contain a number, which is 36 in her case. The exact quote is:
"Pamela Webb, 32.
Found strangled near
the Notch in
Franconia, NH on
July 18, 1989."

The rest of my message was taken from the following quote that I lifted from:
http:/
/www.
maine.
gov/tools/
whatsnew
/index.php?topic=state_police_ unsolved&id=10814&v=Ar ticle-homicides

"Unsolved Homicides
Pamela J. Webb
Case date: 1989
Town: Biddeford

Pamela Webb's 1981 Chevrolet pickup truck was found abandoned on the Turnpike at mile 30.4 southbound in Biddeford on July 2, 1989. The passenger side rear tire was flat and a spare tire was leaning against the tailgate. There were blood stains on the pavement on the passenger side of the truck and earrings near one of the blood stains. Webb's dog was in the front of the truck. A turnpike ticket was found inside the truck indicating Webb entered the turnpike in Augusta at 2152 hours on 07/01/89. Webb was headed to Mason, NH, to visit her boyfriend. The boyfriend reported Webb missing on 07/02/89 at 1009 hours. 75 to 100 people called the State Police to report seeing Webb's truck broken down, but no one was able to provide descriptions of vehicles or persons near the truck.

On July 18, 1989, human remains were found in Franconia, NH, which were subsequently identified at Webb's. The body was severely decomposed with only a small patch of soft tissue left on the skull. Webb was identified through dental records. No bones below the pelvis were found with the remains. A skirt, blouse and bra were recovered with the remains."

The site also has a color photograph of Pamela Webb. She was very beautiful with long brown hair and big soft brown eyes.

Fred

Curious fact:

Webb's intended destination was Mason, NH, where her boyfriend lived. Mason, NH and Warwick, MA are 50.3 miles apart via roads, but it's a 1 hour and 20 minute drive, according to Google.

Distance as the crow flies is 29.11 miles.

Both are little more than places in the country where a couple of roads intersect.

Fred

sophie bean wrote:

Damn, Mason, you're right -#15707 is NOT there - it hops from #15706 to #15708.
Coincidence?
An internal Topix glitch?
I guess, but considering the question is an official inquest report of cause of death in a homicide, it's quite odd that the answer should be so elusive. The Union Leader article states that cause of death could not be determined -Silky's site says that it was death by strangulation. Something definitely does not add up here.

It's possible to guesstimate that the cause of death is manual strangulation from examining skeletal remains, if the hyoid bone is fractured. It's a small and fragile bone in the throat area that breaks when uneven pressure is applied to the neck and throat as the case with manual strangulation.

The problem is the ME can't rule out other potential or contributing causes such as a knife wound, if the knife didn't leave a scrape mark on a bone. According to the info posted on the state's website, the cops found some blood on the road next to Webb's p/u.

I don't know where Silky got her info.

Fred

Mason,
Your post 15707 does not appear to be there. I wanted to add that Rooney was not in jail at the time of Mauras disappearance. Det C found that he was working in the area though.

mcsmom Thanks for the links.

Assuming for the sake of argument, that the same bad guy killed Webb and the woman whose partial remains were discovered in Warwick, MA, does anyone want to hazard a guess regarding where this guy lives?

Don't forget that he also may have killed the Swedish nanny, whose dismembered remains were found in Fenway in 1996.

Fred

If the three homicides were committed by the same guy, the FBI has jurisdiction to jump in and take over the investigations in those cases because acts in three states are involved.

If there's a connection to Maura's case, the Bureau will take over the investigation in her case too.

Fred

Mason wrote:

<quoted text>
It's possible to guesstimate that the cause of death is manual strangulation from examining skeletal remains, if the hyoid bone is fractured. It's a small and fragile bone in the throat area that breaks when uneven pressure is applied to the neck and throat as the case with manual strangulation.

The hyoid bone being broken is a fairly clear indication that manual strangulation was involved (with other indicators) but you can have death by strangulation without the hyoid being broken. It is only broken in 1 out of 3 deaths by strangulation so absence of that finding is not an indicator that death was not by strangulation.

Bill

sophie bean wrote:

<quoted text>
Bill, the point is that it seems reasonably obvious that at least 13 women in the CT River Valley, within a very small geographical area, were located and targeted in identical ways, vanished under similar circumstances, and their remains, in several cases, were found very close together and in a short period of time. Can you possibly believe that all of that is nothing more than coincidence?

I am still watching the videos but so far I see them (them being non-LE) trying to link 4 of the murders together.

Not saying they can't be linked. Just trying to separate sheep dip from Shinola and also trying to know what the professionals believe.

I will watch the rest tonight.

Bill

http://www.courts.state.me.us/court_info/opin...

More curious facts:

1. Mason, NH and Warwick, MA, are each a little over a mile from the border between MA and NH.

2. Mason, NH is 21.75 miles as the crow flies from the Londonderry Tower (Heading 70 degrees, 20 min.).

3.The location where Webb's body was discovered is 15 miles as the crow flies from the scene of the Saturn accident. By road it's 23 miles.

Fred

Re missing post # 15707 .... Mason, if you were not actually logged in on Topix when you made that post, that might explain why we can't see the post but you can. I could be off base, but seems to me that some time back I had made a post by just replying but not being actually logged in, and the post didn't show up when I WAS logged in.

WTF-the-original wrote:

<quoted text>
The hyoid bone being broken is a fairly clear indication that manual strangulation was involved (with other indicators) but you can have death by strangulation without the hyoid being broken. It is only broken in 1 out of 3 deaths by strangulation so absence of that finding is not an indicator that death was not by strangulation.
Bill

I agree, plus, you wouldn't expect to see the hyoid fracture with a ligature strangulation.

The bottom line is we lack sufficient information to justify saying Webb's cause of death was by strangulation.

Fred

Advocator wrote:

Re missing post # 15707 .... Mason, if you were not actually logged in on Topix when you made that post, that might explain why we can't see the post but you can. I could be off base, but seems to me that some time back I had made a post by just replying but not being actually logged in, and the post didn't show up when I WAS logged in.

Thanks, I reposted it farther up this page at message # 15744.

Fred

Another curious fact.

I reviewed all of the female missing person and female unsolved murders on the State of Maine website and the only one that provided any information about the circumstances of the disappearance and/or the circumstances of the recovery of the remains was Pamela Webb's entry. They obviously made an exception to policy for her case.

I suspect they did it because of the unusual and scary facts that distinguish it from the typical murders they deal with. They want people to know her case is different.

Fred

mcsmom wrote:

http://www.courts.state.me.us/court_info/opin...

Thanks for the link to the Supreme Court's decision. I agree with the reasoning and the result, although I feel bad for Pamela's parents who had to deal with this added disappointment to the pain and loss of losing their daughter.

When you get down to the meat of their claim, however, they could not have proven that the cop's negligence and alteration of a document to conceal it would have prevented Pamela's abduction and murder. This is one of the points that I've been emphasizing for a long time about Sgt. Smith who arrived at the scene of the accident after Maura was abducted or voluntarily accepted a ride from someone. Of course, unlike Haas, Smith didn't attempt to change a document and I believe he handled the situation appropriately.

No one disputes that Haas violated police procedure to conceal his negligence. Without any evidence to show that Pamela's abduction would have been prevented if he had not acted negligently and not attempted to conceal his negligence, the Webb's had no chance to prevail on their claim.

If they had asked me to represent them on their claim, I would have turned them down and explained why I believed they would be throwing their money away, if they pursued it. Even in contingency fee cases, the client has to pay the costs, no matter the outcome.

Nothing positive came out of this effort.

Fred

I neglected to mention that we should review the Court's earlier opinion in this matter because they laid out the facts more completely in it and we should review those facts because they probably contain more information than the facts on the state's website.

Maybe that's where Silky got the idea that the cause of death was strangulation.

Fred

I'm thinking that the female victim whose body parts were discovered in Warwick, MA on June 24, 1989, probably was abducted not more than a week before that date.

If we get lucky, there should be a missing person report for a female during that time period in a state that is within 300 miles of Warwick, including Canada's provinces. I suspect the killer is the same person who abducted Pamela and I think it's a pretty safe bet that part of his modus operandi is to widely separate the locations of the abductions from the body disposal sites.

He also needs an intermediate location where he can dismember the body and clean-up the mess. Trying to do that by the light of the silvery Moon isn't a good idea and it would be difficult to explain what the hell you were doing, if someone happened along and started asking questions.

The question is, where did he do his grisly work?

Fred

WTF-the-original wrote:

<quoted text>
I am still watching the videos but so far I see them (them being non-LE) trying to link 4 of the murders together.
Not saying they can't be linked. Just trying to separate sheep dip from Shinola and also trying to know what the professionals believe.
I will watch the rest tonight.
Bill

What videos are you referring to, Mr. Bill?

Fred

Miller's study was presented today at a meeting of the American Heart Association in New Orleans. The researchers pooled data from 19 different trials, which together involved over 130,000 participants.

Vitamin E doses used in the trials ranged from just 16.5 IU up to 2,000 IU, which is double the limit that US dietary guidelines regard as tolerable. On pooling the results, the researchers found that daily doses of 150 IU or less had no adverse effects, and might even offer health benefits. Risk of death started to increase above this level, and became significant at 400 IU and higher.

"Data to support the benefit of these high doses is really nonexistent," says David Waters, professor of medicine at the University of California San Francisco, and a cardiologist at San Francisco General Hospital. "When you call something a 'vitamin', people assume it is beneficial. No one dreams that it could be harmful. But there is no reason why, like any other chemical compound, it shouldn't be harmful when taken above a certain limit."

The study's authors recommend that people should stop taking any high dose vitamin supplements until further clinical trials demonstrate their worth, or at least rule out harm. Vitamins A and D are fat-soluble like vitamin E, and will similarly accumulate in the body's tissues.

ABOVE FROM: http://www.bioedonline.org/picks/news.cfm...