Where is MAURA MURRAY

I'm sorry BEAGLE is that enough for you?

Suzanne wrote:

<quoted text>
MMM SHOULD be bashed, in fact the very bashing of MMM is progress.

Thank you for clarifying my point. We need to go elsewhere if we are to be hlepful here.

FireCat wrote:

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Maybe people don't respond to it because they have nothing to say about it.

Typical slam reply of the Duck Patrol. Firecat's diversionary and disingenuous answer either says the question is too sensitive a subject or it shows how shallow Firecat's commitment is to finding Maura. Firecat doesn't DEIGN to answer. What's wrong? Is the question too important? Too much Amherst for Firecat? Too difficult to answer?

If Firecat wants to find Maura, how come Firecat refuses to answer this question? It's very easy to answer.

M_Chaplin wrote:

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A clamshell is the boom that grabs onto logs on a logging truck! A backhoe which I operate, is a tractor with a front bucket and a digging shovel on the back a.k.a I run a case 580 k extendahoe. Also a front end loader is a large front bucket tractor which I also operate, it's a cat 988 other wise known as the big dog.

Thank you very much. Very specific. Now, could a backhoe with a digging shovel have dug a grave near the Rt. 112 curve around the date that the Saturn was found? If you drove - not had trucked - a backhoe on Rt. 112, especially in February, what motion would the backhoe make? Sort of a rocking back and forth (front to rear) motion?

Thanks again for your answer. I appreciate it?

Suzanne wrote:

There are spineless wimps on this forum, people who do not have the courage of their convictions. People who simper, whimper and whine and cower in a corner for fear of disapproval. These people are so terrified of disapproval that they make me want to puke.
I so totally agree with Mason's last post.

Okay, so you believe the ex-MMM forum was run with an iron hand, but you can only guess why.

Is it possible for you, or anyone, to KNOW why instead of merely guessing? Or learning why? If a poster does learn why, should she divulge the reason?

Should posters on this thread, or any thread or forum, look for the reason the ex-MMM forum might have been run, as you say, with an iron hand?

If the ex-MMM forum was "run with an iron hand," and a poster discovers why, should that reason be stated here on this thread? In PMs? Emails? On another forum?

If the reason for the "iron hand" is easy to discover and it has not been discovered, or at least publicly acknowledged or disclosed as having been discovered, then why not?

Helena, having never run a Forum, was cautious about the discussions because of legal issues. She was apprehensive as to what was written
because of a concern for the outcome, that could have been misconstrued, in any final outcome of Maura's disappearance. I still have my share of
butt gnaw scars from being chastised. Simply put, she had a fear of harming the investigation. I have never asked her, but I have wondered if their attorney advised the family to longer share any more information.

M_Chaplin wrote:

<quoted text>
A clamshell is the boom that grabs onto logs on a logging truck! A backhoe which I operate, is a tractor with a front bucket and a digging shovel on the back a.k.a I run a case 580 k extendahoe. Also a front end loader is a large front bucket tractor which I also operate, it's a cat 988 other wise known as the big dog.

How important is peripheral vision when driving and/or operating a backhoe on or near a public way?

Shack wrote:

Helena, having never run a Forum, was cautious about the discussions because of legal issues. She was apprehensive as to what was written
because of a concern for the outcome, that could have been misconstrued, in any final outcome of Maura's disappearance. I still have my share of
butt gnaw scars from being chastised. Simply put, she had a fear of harming the investigation. I have never asked her, but I have wondered if their attorney advised the family to longer share any more information.

I need to break my normal (normal?) personality here for just a couple of seconds because this is probably the only time I will agree with Shack about ANYthing. Well said, Shack. Thank you. Now back to mud wrestling from hell online.

M_Chaplin wrote:

<quoted text>
There is a small lake called long pond about 20 minutes from the crash site but it's not that deep you can see bottom across the whole thing and you can't drive to it with a car or truck in the winter. A sled or wheeler yes, but most augers drill a hole big enough for a fish not a person weighted to go through. In fact alot of fish are to big to get through the hole they make.

Thank you and to WTF later.

Shack, if it was MY family, I certainly would not share any information I had here! This forum, from the beginning, and continuing till today has been nothing except typical of inflammatory news reporting.

Father Uses Business Skill to Hunt Missing Daughter and Fight His Grief
By JEFFREY SCHMALZ, Special to The New York Times

In hotel lobbies from Puerto Rico to California, posters carry the face of a smiling Tiffany L. Sessions. Truck stops, service stations, fast-food outlets throughout the South give out her picture. One minute her face is on a box of pizza, the next it is on a television commercial.

Five months after Miss Sessions, a 20-year-old college junior, failed to return from an evening walk in Gainesville, Fla., she is the object of what law-enforcement officials believe to be one of the largest private searches for a missing person since Patricia Hearst was kidnapped 15 years ago.

How this particular case - one of more than 6,000 missing person cases in Florida - came to draw so large an effort is the story of Miss Sessions' father, Patrick, a real estate developer here who decided to put all his business skills to work in the search for his daughter. In effect, he has written a new chapter in the textbooks: how to market a missing person.

''If I put a new product on line and it doesn't work out well, I don't say,'Gee, too bad it can't sell,''' Mr. Sessions said.''I bring everybody in and say:'Why isn't it selling? What can we do?' I've done the same thing in the search for Tiffany.'' A Father's Concern

But while Mr. Sessions is very much the businessman, he is also very much the father, using the search effort as a way of easing his feelings of grief and hopelessness.

''People say,'How can you keep it up?' I say,'How can you not?' I do it so I can live with myself,'' Mr. Sessions said.

Instead of leaving the case to the police and the Federal Bureau of Investigation, Mr. Sessions, the 43-year-old president of the Weston division of Arvida, a residential and industrial real estate concern, has organized and led strategy meetings to coordinate various law-enforcement agencies.

Arvida and its parent company, the JMB Realty Corporation of Chicago, have put at his disposal their corporate army, from a battery of secretaries to public-relations experts. Executives at other companies have lent him corporate jets to check tips more quickly.

His efforts have drawn resentment from some poorer parents of other missing children because they regard the police as less interested in their cases and consider themselves lucky if they can get their children's pictures on milk cartons.'I'm No Donald Trump'

Mr. Sessions acknowledged that such aspects of the search for his daughter as the $75,000 reward and the private jets are not available to many other families. But he said:''My wealth is exaggerated. I'm no Donald Trump.''

''You know the big difference between me and other families?'' he asked.''I went out and asked people to help me. It's as simple as that.'' Ads Run Without Charge

He is writing a booklet for families of missing persons telling them how to put pressure on the police and the press for help. It also tells the families to be prepared for the physical strain.(Mr. Sessions lost 25 pounds the first month his daughter was missing.) And it tells them to brace themselves for the inevitable allegations that their children were involved in drugs or worse and that perhaps they themselves were not good parents.

Anne wrote:

Shack, if it was MY family, I certainly would not share any information I had here! This forum, from the beginning, and continuing till today has been nothing except typical of inflammatory news reporting.

Please stop flattering news media.

mcsmom wrote:

Father Uses Business Skill to Hunt Missing Daughter and Fight His Grief
By JEFFREY SCHMALZ, Special to The New York Times
In hotel lobbies from Puerto Rico to California, posters carry the face of a smiling Tiffany L. Sessions. Truck stops, service stations, fast-food outlets throughout the South give out her picture. One minute her face is on a box of pizza, the next it is on a television commercial.
Five months after Miss Sessions, a 20-year-old college junior, failed to return from an evening walk in Gainesville, Fla., she is the object of what law-enforcement officials believe to be one of the largest private searches for a missing person since Patricia Hearst was kidnapped 15 years ago.
How this particular case - one of more than 6,000 missing person cases in Florida - came to draw so large an effort is the story of Miss Sessions' father, Patrick, a real estate developer here who decided to put all his business skills to work in the search for his daughter. In effect, he has written a new chapter in the textbooks: how to market a missing person.
''If I put a new product on line and it doesn't work out well, I don't say,'Gee, too bad it can't sell,''' Mr. Sessions said.''I bring everybody in and say:'Why isn't it selling? What can we do?' I've done the same thing in the search for Tiffany.'' A Father's Concern
But while Mr. Sessions is very much the businessman, he is also very much the father, using the search effort as a way of easing his feelings of grief and hopelessness.
''People say,'How can you keep it up?' I say,'How can you not?' I do it so I can live with myself,'' Mr. Sessions said.
Instead of leaving the case to the police and the Federal Bureau of Investigation, Mr. Sessions, the 43-year-old president of the Weston division of Arvida, a residential and industrial real estate concern, has organized and led strategy meetings to coordinate various law-enforcement agencies.
Arvida and its parent company, the JMB Realty Corporation of Chicago, have put at his disposal their corporate army, from a battery of secretaries to public-relations experts. Executives at other companies have lent him corporate jets to check tips more quickly.
His efforts have drawn resentment from some poorer parents of other missing children because they regard the police as less interested in their cases and consider themselves lucky if they can get their children's pictures on milk cartons.'I'm No Donald Trump'
Mr. Sessions acknowledged that such aspects of the search for his daughter as the $75,000 reward and the private jets are not available to many other families. But he said:''My wealth is exaggerated. I'm no Donald Trump.''
''You know the big difference between me and other families?'' he asked.''I went out and asked people to help me. It's as simple as that.'' Ads Run Without Charge
He is writing a booklet for families of missing persons telling them how to put pressure on the police and the press for help. It also tells the families to be prepared for the physical strain.(Mr. Sessions lost 25 pounds the first month his daughter was missing.) And it tells them to brace themselves for the inevitable allegations that their children were involved in drugs or worse and that perhaps they themselves were not good parents.

Excellent post. Thank you.

Anne, Yes..and you are being nice...!

Shack wrote:

Helena, having never run a Forum, was cautious about the discussions because of legal issues. She was apprehensive as to what was written
because of a concern for the outcome, that could have been misconstrued, in any final outcome of Maura's disappearance. I still have my share of
butt gnaw scars from being chastised. Simply put, she had a fear of harming the investigation. I have never asked her, but I have wondered if their attorney advised the family to longer share any more information.

I'm sure others that were there will remember her saying when the conversation became libelous that she liked her house and didn't want to lose it.
That was when the locals in the immediate area of the accident were being falsely accused of having something to do with Maura's disappearance by name and called rats in a nest, illiterate, scum bags and I could go on and on. Shack wanted to Lysol the whole bunch of us. Remember Shack??
The queen of the attack ducks never let up on the malicious attack of the area, state and locals and it continues to this day . Remember Shack??
I would have been concerned of the outcome too if I was running that forum

M_Chaplin wrote:

"She was incredible — a great athlete," Tom Zamagni said.
"If you wanted to make a person, you would make her just like her." said Katie Jones another close friend of Maura’s since grade school.

Below from "Merchants of Immortality" by Stephen S. Hall:

The laboratory was run by James Robl, a genial and well-respected animal science researcher then on the faculty of the university [UMass]. In 1990 a graduate student in his lab named Philippe Colas (now at the University of Oslo) embarked on a series of experiments attempting to improve basic techniques of cloning, using the rabbit as an experimental species. At some point, as something of a lark, Collas decided to remove some cells from his own cheek and fuse them with the egg cells of rabbits. "We were thinking pretty far out in those days," Collas said. "I did some pretty wild stuff, including cloning myself and also Jim's technician. I was making some beautiful embryos, and the all went to the 32 or 64 cell stage." "They didn't tell me until after they'd done it," Robl recalled. "They were laughing about it, not taking it seriously. So we started watching [the eggs], and they started cleaving, or dividing. And the more they started cleaving, the more nervous I got."

**********

So why FIND Maura Murray? Why not MAKE another Maura Murray? A surprising number of people are doing it with their dead dogs. If they lose a beloved dog, they just get another one, exactly like the one that died.

Mcsmom, took me a bit of time to read...really read that article...stinging wet eyes...must be
the smoke from fireplace...ahem....

M_Chaplin wrote:

"She was incredible — a great athlete," Tom Zamagni said.
"If you wanted to make a person, you would make her just like her." said Katie Jones another close friend of Maura’s since grade school.

You could take some of Maura Murray's DNA - from a toothbrush or a hair brush, for example - and make another Maura Murray just like the first one. She wouldn't have the same memories and so on, but she would BE, biologically, just the same as the first one. Like Dolly the sheep. Remember Dolly? Welcome to ZooMass.

Beagle wrote:

<quoted text>
Thank you very much. Very specific. Now, could a backhoe with a digging shovel have dug a grave near the Rt. 112 curve around the date that the Saturn was found? If you drove - not had trucked - a backhoe on Rt. 112, especially in February, what motion would the backhoe make? Sort of a rocking back and forth (front to rear) motion?
Thanks again for your answer. I appreciate it?

BEAGLE your an IDIOT!!!! Call the HPD I'm on a first name basis with Sgt.Smith and chief Williams. Not to mention Trooper Hubbard is a friend of mine for the last 12 years at least. This latest theory of yours is beyond rediculous.

Beagle wrote:

<quoted text>I need to break my normal (normal?) personality here for just a couple of seconds......... Now back to mud wrestling from hell online.

POssibly the funniest thing you've said in a while.:)