Where is MAURA MURRAY

for the record, i am similarly appalled by my observational knowledge of accusations made about the involvement of SBD from the "other" side, the FIT.
it goes both ways.
an order to cease and desist may have also been appropriate against those who continue to publicly scrutinize his witness statements to the point where he may have felt the need to relocate.
where were the big red warning signs issued by an "officer of the court" while these character assassins have taken place?

what are the moral/ethical/legal limits of these conversations?
both sides seem to be crying foul after engaging in risky behavior.

WHITE WASH wrote:

Let me also point if you look at things in the large picture it's easier!
First off there are 3 people involved!
All do not have their clocks the same as GCSD so the timing will be off
plain and simple as that!
All 3 have very different views given the location of the their homes and wathching areas so for them all the have the same views and opinions ect
is impossible many can not get by this
piece.
Take each witness statement in it's own
is my sugguest for things to make sense.
<quoted text>

That's true. They've done experiments on this. Formal and otherwise. Witness accounts vary WILDLY. Lock six people in a room and have someone run through it. Then ask those six people (separately) what they saw. You'll get AT LEAST six different answers. Sometimes more.

WHITE WASH wrote:

Yes but Red is a very popular color!
I think it's a spin!
Most where traveling through by the plates!
<quoted text>

?

Of the four trucks (one of which was green): three plates were NH (one temp) and the third was VT. Which is fairly close, so might not be "passing through" in the same sense that someone from Virginia or Oregon would be passing through.

This info was just looked up on the log before I typed it, to verify what I remembered.

to whomever has read my post at #18863 and has concluded clueless/nuts/mean...i feel sorry for you.

your failure to understand the spirit of fair, rational commentary following peri's emotionally charged mis-statement of my intent suggests little comprehension on your part.

Mason's theory and quoted text were peri's real concern.
she was reacting to his statements about Fred's involvement in his daughter's disappearance.
she needed to direct her statement about Fred's having an alibi to Mason, not to me.

by participation and observation over time, i can only hope to raise awareness about the implications for HARM TO INNOCENT PARTIES by way of these dangerous and daily accusations made in the course of these extended online conversations, and about who may be responsible for Maura Murray's disappearance.

again, how far do one's freedoms extend when individuals are named, and their involvement suggested in the disappearance of Maura Murray?

think about it.

anyone talk with Billy Rausch lately to ask his opinion about the negative perceptions and conclusions reported on forums relative to his relationship with Maura?
which of us can state with any certainty that he and Maura did or did not anticipate a formal engagement and announcement?

do these forums imitate and mirror the tabloid frenzy of Nancy Grace's programs? is playing 'investigator' a rush for some?

think about it. be honest with yourself.

would any of you feel as comfortable making these accusations face-to-face with the individuals named on these forums?

to me, the features of the curious behavior i've been able to observe here belong in the realm of research...a study in current social psychology.

does anyone of you people know maura?
her boyfriend is bill or william?

peripeteia wrote:

<quoted text>
much progress has been made, we know for sure the author of Maura being intoxicated, came from the SBD
the red truck was seen on Bradley Hill Road by the Dog Watcher, as well as by RO at the SSStore
the car in neutral says the car was pushed or towed, by someone other than Maura, impossible to extract keys from ignition when in neutral
we have the grafton county sherrif logs, FW statements does not support SGt. S accident report
we know FW has changed her story re:, new timeline needs to be drawn, assuming the information provided by WW is the correct version also
info re: JM not being home is most definately in error, why this was said or printed, is unknown
we know RO has changed her story, first afraid of red truck driver, now she thinks he was a look out
and times have not been clarified, other than it was after 7 p.m. and before law enforcement came along.
we know there are inaccuracies and questions which need asking in the SBD and his girlfriend statements and report to 911
Hanover 911 calls (original call by SBD's household are being witheld
the only witness who has not changed their story is JM, his statement do not support the SBD statements
we know the sightings of Maura since the accident were not Maura
we know this is a criminal investigation and that Maura did not run off to start a new life or took her own life regardless of the spin of the posters
we know a cold case squad will be investigating Maura's accident
we know there are posters who work endlessly trying to twist and turn facts and defame the family, Maura, and posters seeking the truth; for what reason, who would hazzard to guess.

Peri,

You are so tangled up in red herrings that you can't see the forest for the trees.

There are no posters "who work endlessly trying to twist and turn facts and defame the family, Maura, and posters seeking the truth." Your statement is false. You have the right to disagree with others, but you cross the line when you accuse them of intentionally defaming Maura, her family, and posters who seek the truth. How can you possibly believe such an absurd statement and why are you so angry? Your outrageous words destroy your credibility more effectively than anything anyone might say.

We ask reasonable questions and until Fred Murray produces the work records I have requested and we have an opportunity to review them and conclude that he could not have been in NH on 2/9 and 2/10 he does not have an alibi.

Look around Peri. You may be the only person still defending Fred Murray. That alone should give you pause.

Please do yourself a favor and get your emotions under control. Your paranoid accusations say nothing about us and everything about your perception and how skewed it is.

You were duped. We all were. Now it's time to wake up and smell the coffee.

I posted this message yesterday on page 80 of the General Discussion thread on the forumer site.

Please read it, Peri. It's in 2 parts.

**********

I do not question anything that RO said about the red truck she saw, but I do question whether it had anything to do with Maura's disappearance. In light of White Wash's recent post regarding FW's recollection of the time period between the accident and her 911 call, which we know was at 7:27 pm, the red truck that RO saw would have passed by the scene of the accident before the accident happened, if it didn't turn off the 112. It would have been miles away when the accident happened.

Don't forget that she described it as an older style pickup with a small window in back and wood slats along the side similar to the trucks that haul away broken tree limbs and yard debris.

There is no reason to believe that the red pickup truck that an unidentified witness claimed to have seen parked beside Bradley Hill Road a mile from the 112 intersection with the driver in the woods is the same truck RO saw and Columbo must have known that when he dropped it into our discussions.

Part 2

Columbo told us that he found out about the red pickup when he read a FIR (field interview report) prepared by one of the PIs. In response to a question I asked, he said he did not know the name of the witness or the date and time that the witness saw the pickup.

When I asked him to find out if the BHR sighting occurred during the relevant time period, he agreed to do so, but he never did. WTF is up with that? I would like to think that if we're playing on the same team he would have known the answers before he posted the tip and if he didn't, he would have mentioned that those questions had to be answered before anyone should get excited about the tip and start making unwarranted assumptions.

RO described an unusual, if not unique looking vehicle that sounds more like a truck than a pickup and, in fact, she called it a "truck." Columbo didn't say, but I'll bet the description provided by the witness on BHR did not mention wood slats.

Can anyone believe that the potential significance of this sighting wasn't important enough to check out in light of RO's experience?

Are we supposed to believe that the PIs are idiots and didn't thoroughly check out that possibility? How long ago was the possibility that the two witnesses saw the same vehicle investigated and eliminated? Are we supposed to believe Columbo did not know this and did not bother to check it out before he told us?

The PIs haven't been sharing information with us, so why did this tip suddenly show up? If the PIs had verified that the witnesses saw the same truck, is anyone daft enough to think they would share that with us? Did the PIs authorize him to leak it? If so, why? I certainly don't have any reason to believe they would do that and I don't think they did. If they didn't, why did Columbo do it?

Why did Columbo bother to drop that tip into our discussions almost 5 years after Maura disappeared? Since he isn't even a member of the PI team why did he release part of their work product?

I have zero respect for Columbo and always will assume that anything he posts here was posted to throw us off track and this is why I asked him to tell us who for whom he works. Someone he knows put him up to this and that person obviously has a significant motive to periodically sabotage what we try to do here or this would not have happened.

Surely I'm not the only one to have noticed that Columbo basically stopped posting after I called him out for his bullshit. I recall him posting a couple of messages after that asking if anyone knew the location of an old church that no longer existed except for its foundations. I believe White Wash asked him why he was asking us since he's the credentialed investigator, which is a damn good question IMO.

Maybe he was looking for a place to pray.

Maybe he should be looking for a place to hide from a bunch of pissed off PIs he offended by selectively distributing worthless information from their work product without authorization.

Marta-Ela wrote:

who saw red truck?
who was driver?
is tepperature in america measured in Farenhajt (° F) or (°C)? because i want to know what temperature was on night maura went missing?

Marta, We measure temps in Fahrenheit here in the US....there would've been Maura's fingerprints all over the car because she had driven the car on many occasions (it was intended to be her primary mode of transportation at school--not sure how long before she started at Amherst that she had the vehicle though) I'm unclear on what the temperature was that night---I remember that is had warmed up considerably from the weeks prior but it was still probably close to freezing (32 F) Billy was in another part of the country, Fred is said to have an alibi but LE did have difficulty reaching him, and I haven't read much about Maura's mom and her whereabouts.

peripeteia wrote:

<quoted text>
we know this is a criminal investigation and that Maura did not run off to start a new life or took her own life regardless of the spin of the posters

Correction--we know it is a criinal investigation, BUT the crime may have happpened long after the Saturn was abandoned by someone.....Maura could have still run away from her life and met up with crime later in her journey.

Bill WTF established that the previous accident and the trailer hitch theories promoted by Columbo are bullshit.

Remember his comment about the Saturn having a flat tire. I asked him to verify that and he never did.

That's three more red herrings to add to Columbo's dissembling.

All 4 red herrings support Fred Murray's claim that a dirtbag abducted and killed Maura.

Why would a father dismiss the possibility that Givmeabrk saw Maura? We have been told that he did because it was checked out and determined to be false, but no details have been provided. The same is true of the Raykel sighting at a church in Vermont. How can such a conclusion be reached unless the women were questioned and why would that be a secret?

Why would a father dismiss the possibility that his daughter was alive unless he knew she was dead. And how could he be so certain?

We've been played for fools and that game is over.

I posted this message this morning in General Discussion on the other site.

I suspect Fred Murray is one of the most prolific dissemblers of information for all time, but I've never had any reason to believe and do not suspect Helena of knowingly distributing false or misleading information.

I believe Helena is an honest and courageous person with good intentions who volunteered to do stuff she had no obligation to do and she paid a heavy price in terms of her health and emotional suffering doing what she believed to be the right thing to do.

And she is not the only one.

Other members of Maura's family, Billy Rausch and his family, all of Maura's friends, a community of good people in NH, other families who have lost a loved one and rallied to support the Murrays, the PI's who volunteered their time and effort to help, two police departments whose competence was questioned, a nation of television viewers who were touched by the story of her disappearance, and finally each one of us including the ducks. It's impossible to know how many have been harmed, but the damage is vast and horrific.

I know one thing for certain. Victimizing a victim and her family is wrong, but if we don't seek the answers to reasonable questions we run the risk of permitting a perpetrator to escape detection by abusing the good will of well intentioned people hiding behind their natural inclination to defend a victim and her family.

We are approaching 48 hours since I asked to see the records and we have not received an answer.

How much longer must we wait?

oh my said that he know what happend to maura bat that he is in danger if he speaks....
???is that a joke? did he report anything?
---and her boyfriend was bill or william?

Marta-Ela wrote:

oh my said that he know what happend to maura bat that he is in danger if he speaks....
???is that a joke? did he report anything?
---and her boyfriend was bill or william?

OH MY says a lot, on a lot of different forums. I don't know how much he knows but he doesn't seem to mind naming names and throwing blame in many directions. If he knows something, he should go to LE directly, not throw things out there to create rumors. Billy, Bill, William--they're all the same person...Maura's boyfriend at the time of her disappearance.

peripeteia wrote:

<quoted text>

we know this is a criminal investigation and that Maura did not run off to start a new life or took her own life regardless of the spin of the posters

Credible arguments have been posted supporting each of the three possible outcomes.

A poll on the other site established that, although many of us suspect Maura was murdered, the majority of those who voted would have a reasonable doubt that she was murdered unless her body is found.

The person who killed her wouldn't need to know that her body was discovered to know that she was murdered, right?

Who ruled out the other two possibilities before anyone else and, with so much unknown, how could he be so certain?

If one assumes Maura would not have willingly accepted a ride from a stranger, from whom would she have accepted a ride after refusing to accompany the SBD?

Why did Fred Murray first contact HPD almost 24 hours after the accident?

Before you answer that question, answer this one.

In a swearing contest between Sgt. Smith, who has no reason to lie, and Fred Murray, whom do you believe?

Can anyone imagine an innocent father intentionally concealing evidence about his missing daughter's state of mind and tossing red herrings into the investigation of her disappearance?

Why didn't Maura tell her father that Billy proposed marriage and she accepted?

Mason wrote:

Why did Fred Murray first contact HPD almost 24 hours after the accident?
Before you answer that question, answer this one.
In a swearing contest between Sgt. Smith, who has no reason to lie, and Fred Murray, whom do you believe?

Just playing devil's advocate here: We don't know for a fact that Sgt. Smith had no reason to lie, do we? I can envision reasons he might lie, just as much as I can envision reasons Fred might.